] c/ \ /___\ *** THE OZZY DIGEST, OCTOBER 1, 1996 *** |@ @| | V | \\\ |\_/| | ;;; \-/ \ ;/ >< ] Hi everyone! Well, for the first time in the history of the Ozzy Digest, there was no Digest for TWO DAYS IN A ROW! I apologize to everyone, but I have had a very hectic weekend which has included shopping for a new computer! Yes folks, after 12 YEARS of virtually uninterrupted loyalty to Commodore/Amiga, I have finally caved in and am going to get a Pentium/Windows based system! Forgive me Amiga loyalists but I'm tired of waiting until the Magic Belt's next 1,000-miracle tune-up for Amiga to catch up to the age of Ozma! FWIW, I fear the only thing that can save Amiga now is a buy-up by Smith and Tinker's. Anyway, I apologize for the delays, and the Digest will now return to its regularly scheduled programming... :) ONLY 18 MORE DAYS UNTIL THE SOUTH WINKIE CONVENTION! -- Dave ============================================================================= Date: Sat, 28 Sep 1996 07:59:01 -0700 (PDT) From: Eric Gjovaag Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 09-27-96 > From: Nathan DeHoff > Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 09-26-96 > > David and Eric: > What was the Oogaboo-related contradiction? I recently purchased both of your > books (_Glass Cat_ and _Queen Ann_), and, as far as I can remember, the only > major contradiction was that in _Queen Ann_, all of the men in Oogaboo were > named either Jo or Jol, and in _Glass Cat_, some of them had other names. By > the way, I enjoyed both of the books. WEll, first of all it's not Karyl and I who named all the men Jo (or, to use it's archaic equivalent, Jol), but Baum. (For those who don't know, "Queen Ann" is a follow-up to Baum's "Tik-Tok of Oz.") But the contradiction isn't in the published version anyway. Our original ms. for "Queen Ann" included a postscript that (***Spoiler Alert!***) showed some of the major Emerald City celebrities coming to Oogaboo in preparation for Ozma making it snow in the mountains and Jody's forest being transported to the pass. This, then, explains the endpapers of the hardback edition, if you've seen that, showing everyone playing in the snow. Our book is set in the mid-40's (Earth time), while David's is set in more contemporary times, yet in "Glass Cat" the pass is still barren and dry. But never fear, if Karyl and I EVER get around to writing that sequel to "Queen Ann," it will be about Jody Forest and her efforts to bring snow to the pass, and it can be reconciled with "Glass Cat." (***Okay, start reading again, no more spoilers.***) > Eric: > I doubt that its disagreement with GLASS CAT was the real reason that the > epilog of QUEEN ANN was cut, but it's theoretically possible - BoW had had > the MS of GLASS CAT for about 8 months before QUEEN ANN was published. And BoW had the ms. of "Queen Ann" for about two years before it was published. It was cut for space reasons, as were a few other tidbits, but despite weakening the ending a bit, I don't think any of the cuts hurt the story at all. Other than the epilog, it was mostly Winkie Convention in-jokes. I'm going to start the final FAQ upgrade this weekend, I'll let everyone know how far I get Monday. --Eric Gjovaag # Come visit my "Wizard of Oz" web site! http://www.eskimo.com/~tiktok/ # ===================================================================== Date: Sat, 28 Sep 1996 13:28:33 -0400 From: RMorris306@aol.com Subject: Recent Ozzy Digests Hi again! Some rare free time: Ruth Berman wrote: <> And Fred Stone's Scarecrow--who, unlike Bolger's, Thompson had actually seen when she wrote most of her books--could have done even better. Eric Gjovaag wrote: <<..you can coordinate with Karyl and me, and maybe we won't contradict each other again. (Hmm, maybe THAT'S the real reason our epilogue was cut from "Queen Ann"...)>> That's the first I've heard of it...what was your Epilogue about? It's interesting, though, that so many Oz writers (you, David, the author of the Nero Zeero story) seem to return to Oogaboo for a setting, whereas I don't remember anyone using, say, Rigmarole Town. (Hey, maybe that's a thought if I ever write an Oz book...especially if BoW pays by the word!) Nathan DeHoff wrote: <> That's right; I'm one of those who finds Thompson's occasional severe punishments (for Mombi, as well as Crunch, Mooj, Glegg and others) rather off-putting, as opposed to Baum's rather gentle disposal of most of his villains. <> Agreed! And, as we all know, RINKITINK was a special case; changed into an Oz book at the last minute. No doubt Inga himself was able to free his parents in Baum's original, non-Oz, manuscript. David Hulan wrote: <> For the most part, though, Baum tried to make his little kingdoms relevant to the plot, as in LOST PRINCESS, where in Thi the travellers learned of the background of the villain, Ugu the Shoemaker, and in Bear Center the Big Lavender Bear joined the party and played a role in the rest of the book. Thompson at her best did that, too, as in my first of her books, JACK PUMPKINHEAD, where only a few places like Chimneyville and Swing City were completely irrelvant. (The Christmas tree and Scare City might have seemed so, if they hadn't been responsible for the travellers picking up the Red Jinn's dinner bell and meeting Snif the Iffin, both of them important to the main plot.) It's hard to really pin down the ways in which Thompson tends to talk down to the reader more than Baum, and it also depends on how much tolerance one has for that sort of thing (and mine's high; how else could I enjoy the Pooh books?) The only one that really comes to mind was the claim that all candles, even in the outside world, came from Illumi Nation, clearly not the case (as opposed to Baum's having the Big Lavender Bear threaten to send a recalcitrant subject to America for a child to play with...but he never indicated that all toy bears came from Bear Center, or even that he would, or could, ever carry out such a threat). Tyler Jones wrote: <> It depends. I certainly don't think, nor do many here seem to, that OZOPLANING was one of her better books (and her late IWOCC novels, YANKEE and ENCHANTED ISLAND, were nothing to write home about, either), but on the whole her novels of the '30's did seem to be where she finally hit her stride. I liked most of her books, though the consensus is probably right that GRAMPA and COWARDLY LION weren't among her better ones (though I still liked both better than OZOPLANING). Rich Morrissey ===================================================================== Date: Sat, 28 Sep 1996 15:26:50 -0400 From: "Melody G. Keller" <104270.2374@compuserve.com> Subject: Ozzy Digest, 09-24-96 Jane: Five manuscripts? Don't worry. In March 1997, the IWOC will likely be bombed by last-minute Oz Book Contest submissions... David: Thanks for catching me in a goof. Ozma acts the most like her Baumian self in Speedy in Oz, one of my OTHER favorite RPT's. Shall have to look at Wishing Horse again--she may be next-closest to her Baumian self in that one--what little we see of her. I'll try to find the 400-mile reference for you. Mom & Dad Save the World seems to have been a Made-for-Cable movie. You can buy or rent it at the video stores. Warning: more violence than MGM's Wizard--though the villain's villainy is probably comparable to the Nome King's--look at how he executes his general in "Emerald City." However, the Spengans WILL remind you of the silllier Oz characters. Melody Grandy ===================================================================== Date: Sat, 28 Sep 1996 22:25:59 -0400 (EDT) From: Gili Bar-Hillel Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 09-28-96 Just read Tony Kushner's "Angels in America" for a class on 20th century American Theatre. Have any of you seen this? There are some Ozzy references in the second part of the play that could be interpreted in rather interesting ways... But I won't go into this in detail unless any of you are acquainted with the play and are interested in discussing it. Ruth Berman - I'm sure you know this, but just as a reminder, Yip Harburg's biography is actually called "who put the rainbow in the wizard of oz". Hah! In fact, I have just now gotten to the part of the digest where you write that you are now reading this biography... :-) Nathan - the animal at the end of my message is supposed to be a sleeping cat. It is not my own work, I stole it from somebody else. I used to have the artist's little copyright next to it, but that got erased, not on purpose! |\ _,,,---,,_ /,`.-'`' -. ;-;;,_ Gili Bar-Hillel, |,4- ) )-,_..;\ ( `'-' abhillel@fas.harvard.edu '---''(_/--' `-'\_) gili@scso.com http://www.scso.com/~gili ===================================================================== Date: Sat, 28 Sep 1996 19:56:24 -0600 From: khackney@hub.ofthe.net (Kenneth Hackney) Subject: Gnome King and The Forbidden Fountain >Yes, he was also dipped in the Forbidden Fountain (presumably >Thompson wrote this part hurriedly, and forgot that one had to drink the water >for it to take effect), but Ruggedo seemed to be largely immune to this water. ************************Spoiler for Emerald City of OZ************************ Guess I need to go back and reread this, but Ruggedo was called Roquat the Red until his first immersion in the Forbidden Fountain. He was held in the water, as I remember it, until he finally swallowed some. Then he forgot his name and his intentions, which were the conquest of the Emerald City. This occured at the end of The Emerald City of OZ. Before him the Whimsies, Growliewogs and Phantasms had been able to drink of the Forbidden Fountain to quinch the thirst created by marching through the dust placed in the gnomes' tunnel by the Wizard under the direction of Glinda. Roquat was thoroughly affected by the waters and was like a smiling child full of wonder at the glitter of the Emerald City. However, OZMA let the Gnome King go home, and there he relearned his wicked ways, although not his original name apparently, as he was henceforth called Ruggedo the Rough and not Roquat the Red. ************************As If You Really Needed This Warning****************** On how many occassions was the Gnome King dipped in the fountain? Two. Maybe he had some lesser effect to a second exposure. When he had already been held in the water until he drank some in an earlier book, why repeat all the detail when this is done again years later? Regards, Ken H. ====================================================================== Date: Sat, 28 Sep 1996 23:16:08 -0400 (EDT) From: Nathan DeHoff Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 09-28-96 Aaron: I think that only the band that kidnapped Ojo was banished from Oz. There are probably several different gypsy tribes in the country. _Enchanted Island_ mentions a group of Gypsy Giants, and it is highly doubtful that they spent any time in Europe. Besides, the gypsies mentioned by Toby Bridlecull (the highwayman in _Forbidden Fountain_), did not really live in Oz, but in the Impassable Desert. Presumably they had some sort of magic that protected them from the harmful effects of the desert sands. Regarding the illustrations: I did notice that Neill's drawings seemed to deteriorate a little over the years. They were still pretty good in the later books, but there were contradictions of the text, even in Neill's own books, if I remember correctly. -Nathan Mulac DeHoff ===================================================================== Date: Sun, 29 Sep 1996 06:34:25 -0700 (PDT) From: Eric Gjovaag Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 09-28-96 Oops, forgot to mention this the other day: Saw a notice in Thursday's paper that "The Oz Kids Collection" will be released on video on Tuesday. Coincidentally, that's payday for me... My suggestion for Ken's chronologies: Serialize it. Send Dave the chronologies for two or three books a day. But I may also be able to put the whole thing on my FTP site, once I get it up and running. > From: Richard Bauman <72172.2631@CompuServe.COM> > Subject: Today's Growls > > Hmmm - Percy Vere the rhymer. My favorite comic strip was always Alley Oop. > Alley had a friend, Foozy, who said everything in rhyme. The strip started in > 1933. I wonder if V.T. Hamlin got the idea from RPT? Grandpa was published in > 1924. Anybody know any other rhyming characters in literature, etc.? Scraps. Just about everyone in Shakespeare. --Eric Gjovaag # Come visit my "Wizard of Oz" web site! http://www.eskimo.com/~tiktok/ # ===================================================================== Date: Sun, 29 Sep 1996 11:34:44 -0400 From: DavidXOE@aol.com Subject: Ozzy Digest, 09-28-96 Nathan: I agree that I prefer Melody's chapters about the Mangaboos in DISENCHANTED PRINCESS than Baum's in DOTWIZ. But then, DISENCHANTED PRINCESS is a much better book than DOTWIZ. Ruth: It's true that we get Ozma's viewpoint very briefly in KABUMPO and JACK PUMPKINHEAD, though it's so brief that I hadn't even noticed it until you pointed it out. And even in those cases we see almost nothing of her thoughts. It could be argued that in those cases we're not really getting Ozma's viewpoint, but the omniscient author's viewpoint telling us what she wants us to know about Ozma's thoughts and feelings. Interesting speculation - as I mentioned the other day, Harburg's other best-known musical is probably FINIAN'S RAINBOW, where again the rainbow is a dominant symbol ("Look to the Rainbow" echoing "Over the Rainbow", perhaps?). Wonder if he had an impressive childhood experience with a rainbow? Danny: I know that Neill's eyesight was failing badly toward the end of his life, and that the deterioration in the detail of his drawings has been at least partially attributed to that. I don't know if that was the whole explanation for the shift in his style (and I agree that his most impressive work was done early, with ROAD my favorite collection of illustrations, though it's my least favorite Baum as a story), but it was undoubtedly part of it. Aaron: I don't think there's any reason to believe that the gypsy tribe in OJO comprised the whole gypsy population of Oz, or that Ozma banished any Ozian gypsies other than Zithero's tribe. So the gypsies referred to in FORBIDDEN FOUNTAIN never caused me any problem. Your suggestion that Glinda discovered the danger to Zithero's tribe when Hitler came to power and advised Ozma to bring them back to Oz (with their first stop being a "re-education camp"?) would also make sense. Bear: Other rhyming characters in literature, etc.? I remember "Bucky Bug", which was a standard feature in WALT DISNEY'S COMIC AND STORIES back in the Forties, where all the characters spoke in verse. And there was "Clancy, the Rhyming Cop" (at least, I think that was his name) who was a sort of comic relief strip in one of the superhero comics - I think from DC - in those days as well. (His gimmick was looking for a rhyme for a particular word throughout the story; then, when he'd capture the villain, the villain would say a word that gave him his missing rhyme.) Both of these are more "etc." than "literature", but then so is Foozy. In Oz, Scraps speaks in verse as often as not, and the Flittermouse in MERRY-GO-ROUND does as well. And everyone who rides Pigasus has to speak in verse, but you haven't gotten to the two books where he appears yet. I'm sure there are lots more, but those are ones who come to me offhand. (Of course, almost all of Shakespeare's characters speak in verse all the time, though it's usually not rhymed. ) David Hulan ====================================================================== Date-warning: Date header was inserted by delphi.com From: dsparker@mail.utexas.edu (Douglass S. Parker) Subject: Re: Volkov books Query: Has anyone an address for the publisher[s] of the Volkov Oz-types creations as given in the Ozzy Digest FAQ 2.10--"Peter Blystone and the Red Branch Press"? Or are the books long gone into OP-land? I haven't been able to run books or publishers down in normal commercial channels--Books In Print and the like. Doug Parker ====================================================================== Date: Sun, 29 Sep 1996 19:55:07 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Olderman Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 09-28-96 "Over the Rainbow" was the name of chapter 12 in Neill's LUCKY BUCKY. I wonder if Harburg minded the use of the name; it certainly fit the chapter well enough, but I won't say how 'cause it'd be a spoiler. Neill goofs: P.40 of THE OZ GAME BOOK shows a few of Neill's errors. If I ever get around to the second game book, I'll include others. Denslow goof: p.15 of THE OZ GAME BOOK. (Too many body parts for the Tin Woodman. Actually, maybe this picture gave Baum the idea for Chopfyt...) Dirk goof: p.21 of OGB. This one, like the upside down scarecrow Ruth's already mentioned, is the publisher's fault. The illo is reversed. ====================================================================== Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 09:04:52 -0400 (EDT) From: "Mark K. DeJohn" <103330.323@CompuServe.COM> Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 09-28-96 From: Barbara DeJohn Hello everyone At the local mall was the "Wizard of Oz" bus yesterday. It is sponsored by Greyhound and has a small museum with it. The museum had picture boards of the movie, several costumes (Dorothy's, two munchkin and a winkie hat), replica ruby slippers, two TV sets with films one about make-up and the other special effects and the mattel dolls. Laurel had her picture taken with the Scarecrow. I asked what their future schedule was to pass it on to you but the guy I talked to said he had the schedule at his hotel. I gave him my card but he hasn't gotten back to me yet. He did know that they are going to be in the Boston area on Friday and Sat. so you Bean Townies can look for it. They gave out Greyhound bus info with WoOZ themes and coupons for the mall but they were only good for that day. I met two women who were taking pictures, like I was who said that they were the biggest WoOZ fans. I asked them if they knew about about IWOCand they didn't so I told them to call me and I'd fill them in on it. Ozzily, Barbara 103330.323@compuserve.com ====================================================================== Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 15:18:58 -0400 From: OzBucket@aol.com Subject: All That I am not usually interested in watching *All That* (a sketch comedy on Nickelodeon), as what I've seen of it did not appeal to my personal tastes, but I happened to catch a few minutes of it the other day. It had a very odd parody of the MGM movie called *The Wizard of Cos* A Bill Cosby imitator was the Wizard, and Dorothy met a toad-man and a man made of pasta. I'm not sure when it re-runs, but you might be interested in it, or maybe someone on the Digest would. ====================================================================== Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 19:07:05 -0400 From: Ozisus@aol.com Subject: Maguire's Topeka appearance I've been notified that Gregory Maguire's talk and book signing at Washburn University in Topeka, Ks., has been effected by airline scheduling problems. His talk on campus will be from 7:30 to 9:00 p.m. Saturday, Oct. 19. He will sign books during this time; a scheduled book signing at the Topeka Public Library that afternoon had to be cancelled. Steve Teller , you and I be the only Digesters within driving distance. LEt me know if you are coming. I hope to attend but don't know for sure yet. Jane ====================================================================== ] c/ \ /___\ *** THE OZZY DIGEST, OCTOBER 2, 1996 *** |@ @| | V | \\\ |\_/| | ;;; \-/ \ ;/ >< ] ============================================================================= Date: Tue, 01 Oct 1996 01:17:25 +0000 From: rri0189@ibm.net Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 09-25-96 Homer: You asked the question a few days ago, but as no one else seems to have answered.... (It's late and I've been skimming. If someone else did answer and I missed it, I apologize.) No, our own Jane Albright has not been leading a double life in TV-land. The actress *Jane* Curtin plays Dr. *Mary* Albright on "3rd Rock From the Sun." -- Eleanor Kennedy ====================================================================== Date: Tue, 01 Oct 1996 02:53:03 -0400 From: Tyler Jones <104707.656@compuserve.com> Subject: Ozzy DIgest Nathan: I would welcome any reviews of Buckethead books by you. A rating is not required, of course. I only ask that you either use the one in place now or use nothing. This is not to force people to think like me, but rather to give a uniform scale so that people can get a consensus among people who do rate them. If you choose not to rate books, then that does not apply. To send me a review, just write it up and mail it to me privately. While I accept negative reviews, I ask that you be obejctive in your writing. Steve: The Queen of the Faries is named Zurline in _Santa Claus_. I used to think that Lurline, Zurline and Lulea were all the same person, but I no longer do, since they appear to behave different and have different powers and responsibilities. Aaron, Steve and mythology: I have always been under the impression that mythology is a very hodgepodge collection of stories and tales, many of which contradict each other and sometimes give the same god/goddess different characteristics and manifestations. I do not know if there is an "official" greek mythology against which other stories can be checked. Danny: Your point has been noted before by people, although neve mentioned in the digest, IIRC. Neill's work started to drop off toward the end of RPT and was quite inferior to his early work. David and Nathan: Another possible explanation is that different passes were used in the books. WHile it is mentioned somewhere that there is only one pass in and out of Oogaboo, this information was probably given by the Oogaboos themselves. They rarely if ever leave their country and few visit, so it is possible that there are many passes through the mountains and people may actually use two of them while believing they used the same one! David: Bob Up stayed in Oz because he had nothing to go home to, unlike Peter and Speedy. Button-Bright apparantly had a family, and he even went back to them once, after _Road_, but for some unexplained reason, he stayed after his adventure in _Scarecrow_. Also, I got your message to my old address and you should have recieved my reply. It is strange that my old account still works. They told me that it would be killed two weeks after I started with my new address, and I have been here at least 15 days. However, it may be destroyed at any time, so please if anybody sends me private e-mail, do so at my new address. --Tyler Jones ====================================================================== Date: Tue, 01 Oct 1996 11:33:19 -0400 (EDT) From: Nathan DeHoff Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-01-96 Ken: Actually, the Nome King drank water from the Forbidden Fountain on three occasions, in _Emerald City_, _Magic_, and _Gnome King_. After the first drink, it took Roquat/Ruggedo some time, as well as exposure to the Nome Kingdom, to relearn his old ways. The second time, however, the magic of the water "wore off," as Thompson states in _Kabumpo_. I only read part of _Pirates_, and I read that part only once, but I seem to remember Thompson saying that the water wore off that time, as well. Perhaps the Nome King built up an immunity to the water, or maybe he was aided by some other magic. Actually, now that I think about it, it might have been Glegg who restored Rug's memory between _Magic_ and _Kabumpo_, since the former Nome King was an important part of his plan to marry Peg Amy. Eric: Hope to see the _Queen Ann_ sequel soon! Rich: Oogaboo may have been used in modern books because it was a fairly major Oz nation. Most of the other minor Kingdoms in Baum's books (like Rigmarole Town) were only briefly visited, while Oogaboo was the home of several major characters in _Tik-Tok_. Thompson used many minor Oz Kingdoms as homes for important characters (Pumperdink, Ragbad, Kimbaloo, the Land of the Barons, Corumbia, and Keretaria are just a few examples), but the books containing these Kingdoms are still in copyright. Yes, the places visited in _Lost Princess_ were relevant to the plot, but _Lost Princess_ was quite possibly Baum's best-plotted books. Baum certainly introduced a lot of minor Oz communities that were irrelevant to the plot, such as Mist Valley, the Great Waterfall, Loonville, and pretty much every place visited in _Emerald City_. I also have tolerance for the "talking down" in Thompson's books, and I even enjoy it sometimes! -Nathan Mulac DeHoff ====================================================================== Date: Tue, 01 Oct 1996 11:08:08 -0400 From: DavidXOE@aol.com Subject: Ozzy Digest, 10-01-96 Dave: Congratulations on the new computer! (Even if it is the kind that supports Bill Gates's Evil Empire... :-) ) You do realize, of course, that I've been going through withdrawal the last couple of days! (Greatly amusing my wife as I log on every couple of hours and then whimper, "STILL no Ozzy Digest!") Eric: It's true that the forest isn't actually moved in the published version of QUEEN ANN, but Ozma says it will be, and that means it surely happened, right? Rich: I think it's fairly easy to understand why other Oz writers have returned to Oogaboo more than to other Oz sites - it's a reasonably complete, well-set-up small kingdom, and there aren't many of those in PD as yet. The little places Dorothy visits in EC (Cuttenclips, Fuddlecumjig, Utensia, Bunbury, Bunnybury, Rigmarole Town, Flutterbudget Center) are mostly so specialized that they wouldn't support much action. The Hoppers and Horners are possibilities, as are Thi and Herku (in fact, Herku is used in GLASS CAT, although it's not visited); Jinxland and the Hyup country are so isolated that they'd be difficult. I think Dave is using the Flathead/Skeezer country in LOCASTA AND THE THREE ADEPTS. In another couple of years, assuming they don't extend copyrights again, I fully expect to see Pumperdink reappearing in new books. (And BoW doesn't pay by the word, I can assure you...) Thi is totally irrelevant to the plot of LOST PRINCESS; the travelers found out about Ugu in Herku. Thi was nothing but padding, like the Winkie who couldn't understand the speech of animals and the Merry-go-round Mountains. (Fun padding, but IEs for sure.) The same could be said for the Loons and the Hip-po-gy-raf in TIN WOODMAN, and the giant spiders and the mist valley in GLINDA. And, of course, the whole plot of DOTWIZ after the arrival of the Wizard in the Mangaboo Country was really an IE, since by 4:00 PM that day Dorothy could have made the sign, had Ozma bring them all to Oz, and then send home those who wanted to go back to America. I think just about everyone agrees that OZOPLANING is one of Thompson's worst books, but one also has to recognize that she was feuding with R&L by the time she wrote it, and probably wasn't trying very hard. The rest of her books steadily get better starting around GNOME KING and continuing up through OJO, after which she was at a plateau of quite high quality that continued until the anomalous case of OZOPLANING. (Before GNOME KING she was erratic; there were some good books and some rather poor ones, though opinions differ a good deal on which were which.) Ken H.: ************Spoilers for EMERALD CITY and MAGIC************* Actually, the Nome King was only Roquat the Red in EC; in OZMA he was Roquat of the Rocks. And Ozma placed the dust in the tunnel at the Scarecrow's advice; neither Glinda nor the Wizard were involved. And while Ruggedo wasn't dipped in the Fountain of Oblivion in MAGIC, he did drink of its water then and once again forgot his past. *************End spoilers******************************** Steve: Off topic, but I saw in the sports section of the TRIB the other day that your school had just set a new NCAA record for consecutive football wins. Congratulations! David Hulan ====================================================================== Date: Tue, 01 Oct 1996 13:18:34 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Olderman Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-01-96 ENCHANTED ISLAND was written quite a long time ago. Ruth polished it up at the request of the Oz Club, and added Oz elements to it. Like Baum's RINKITINK, it hadn't been planned as an Oz book. YANKEE went to press with essentially no editing, just proofing. That may be why they feel so different from her other books. Neill's illos also changed with the simpler line drawing styles of more modern times. Early in the Oz series, he's still busy imitating Denslow's poster style, but by ROAD, he's ready to do his own thing...to the point of ridiculing Denslow in the illo of Dorothy tittering and Toto cracking up at his versions of them. Like Ruth Berman, I think the finest of his work--certainly the richest, most involved, detailed, and beautifully convoluted--is in ROAD for his Oz drawings, but his work in PETER AND THE PRINCESS is utterly gorgeous--delicate and romantic...well worth hunting. I'll try to remember to check for the author's name when I get home; I'm at school now. Then some of you DIGESTERS may get a chance to see it, too. CHRIS: Good to see you back in the DIGEST. I was beginning to worry about you! --Robin ====================================================================== Date: Tue, 01 Oct 1996 14:38:04 -0700 From: "Stephen J. Teller" Subject: OZMA, Reggedo et al. ***SPOILER FOR LOST KING *** IMHO the low point of Ozma's career is in the book LOST KING. Here she becomes dithering and almost incompetant. When she meets Pastoria she is ready to abdicate in his favor. When the question of what to do with Mombi arises, she lets Dorothy decide for her, permitting her foster mother to be destroyed summarily, in contrast to the way she treated enemies in LFB's books. ***END OF SPOILER****** Roquat's name change: This is a case where theatrical matters impugned of literary ones. In LFB's third Ozian Musical THE TIK-TOK MAN OF OZ (which was largely based on OZMA OF OZ) he called the king Ruggedo, so when this was transformed into a book the name was retained, and a footnote was inserted to justify the change. Neill's Art: It is true that Neill's work greatly simplified over the years, but this may partly due to a change in tastes. Even in his earliest illustrations he was not always faithful to his text. In OZMA Langwidaire's hair (on the head she was wearing at the time) is described as being black, but in the pictures it is platinum blonde. In the illustration in which the Scarecrow throws the egg at the Nome King, the Tin Woodman is visible in the background although he was a Tin Whistle at the time. Maguire lecture: I do not know if I will try to attend the Maguire lecture in Topeka. It is about a 3 hour drive each way, and six hours on the road is a lot of driving to hear the author of WICKED. Now if LFB were speaking I would not hesitate, but that is unlikely. Steve T. ====================================================================== Date: Tue, 01 Oct 1996 21:06:10 -0400 (EDT) From: Richard Bauman <72172.2631@CompuServe.COM> Subject: Today's Growls Dave - Glad you have solved your hardware problem. I can tell you you had some of us worried. The last Digest like this vanished in cyberspace without a whisper. Eric - you have let slip you have a job - the "payday" reference. So is it in teaching or are you designing WWW pages for a living? Eric/David - Rhyming characters. Another I remember is "the Rhyming Rabbit" from one of the all time great radio shows, "Judy and Jimmy and The Cinnamon Bear." Friends, if you like Oz books you'll love this! Easily available from many sources now. I had to fight Inkaboos, avoid the Wintergreen Witch and wrestle the Crazy Quilt Dragon to get my original copy. Regards, Bear (:<) ====================================================================== Date: Wednesday 02-Oct-96 12:10:12 From: Dave Hardenbrook Subject: Ozzy Things RUG AND THE H2O OF OB.: MOPPeT (presented in _Locasta_) is that between _Magic_ and _Kabumpo_, Ruggedo magically not only regained his memory, but also aquired an immunity to the Water of Ob. for ever after. (I'm NOT at liberty to reveal what that magic was, however...) OZMA ESSAY: David Hulan's essay on Ozma's rule is now in my Ozzy file archive and anyone may request it. I have finally gotten around to reading it and it is a good essay. David shares my view that Ozma's abduction in _Lost Princess_ motivated her to garner much more wisdom and other leadership qualities, as well as much more magical powers. The only addtional thing in my MOPPeT about Ozma is that Thompson (or maybe her informants) disliked Ozma's new strong-mindedness and so painted Ozma in the worst possible light (thus her *apparently* sordid behavior in _Lost King_ and elsewhere). NEW DIGEST POLICY: Well, not actually a new *policy*. but I'm going to ask a big favor of everyone...Could you all please make a point of putting the letters "Oz" somewhere in the Subject: line of your Digest submissions? This would make it much easier for me to isolate the Digest messages from the mass of other mail I receive each day, and more quickly incorporate them in the Digest. Most people have "Oz" in their subjects already, saying either "Oz", or "Ozzy Digest" or replying to the Digest directly, so their mailers automatically make the subject, "RE: Ozzy Digest". These people need do nothing different in future, but for those who regularly have subject lines that don't include the string "Oz", I'm asking them, as a favor to me, to do so in future, even it is as a "header", e.g. "Oz: Today's Growls". I will NOT exclude your message if it lacks "Oz", that would be unfair of me, but just advising everyone on how they can make my life a little easier. :) -- Dave ====================================================================== ] c/ \ /___\ *** THE OZZY DIGEST, OCTOBER 3, 1996 *** |@ @| | V | \\\ |\_/| | ;;; \-/ \ ;/ >< ] ============================================================================= Date: Wed, 02 Oct 1996 00:48:56 -0400 From: RMorris306@aol.com Subject: Recent Ozzy Digests Tyler Jones wrote: <> He ignored them, but for the most part seemed to try to be consistent with them (and I can't really fault him for changing the Soldier with the Green Whiskers back to Omby Amby rather than Wantowin Battles...nor for presenting an Oz free of Scalawagons and without the Scarecrow (inexplicably) as King of the Munchkins). He certainly included all the writers in WHO'S WHO IN OZ, except the then-unpublished MERRY GO ROUND. Bear wrote: <> It's magic, not science. How is that different from the Silver Shoes taking Dorothy home (in WIZARD) in three steps? Kenneth Hackney wrote: <> Or, as his name was given on his first appearance in OZMA, Roquat of the Rocks. <> As several of us here have theorized, nomes in general may have the ability to shake off the effects, not to mention building up an immunity. The Oz people suspect his own subjects "taught him to be as wicked as he was before," but I suspect he just got his memory and personality back. True, he changed his name (no doubt because Baum had used the name of Ruggedo for the character in his musical), but I never quite bought that he'd forgotten the name Roquat...Ozma TOLD it to him after his amnesia in EMERALD CITY. I suspect he never liked his original name, and jumped at the excuse to change it. In any case, he drank from the fountain again in MAGIC, but had his memory back within three years in KABUMPO...and seemed to regain it almost immediately after GNOME KING, if he'd even lost it at all. By that time, I suspect, he'd become completely immune to it. David Hulan wrote: <> Actually, you're combining two DC features. Henry Boltinoff, brother of DC editor Murray Boltinoff and a well-known magazine cartoonist, did a number of one-page features for the company, with regular characters ranging from a typical boy and girl (Little Pete and Bebe) to more exotic characters including Super-Turtle, Moolah the Mystic, and Tricksy the World's Greatest Stunt Man. One of them was Clancy the Cop--who, especially in later years, was more often Casey the Cop. But I think the character you're thinking of was Hayfoot Henry, a 5-page (later dropped to 4-page) backup in ACTION COMICS, the DC comic book that led off with Superman (and still does) during the middle 1940's. Henry (Henry Wadsworth Shortfellow) was writing a rhyming dictionary, but he and everyone else in the strip talked in rhyme, with the entire script being written as a poem (including captions and sound effects). As it happens, the strip was written by a friend of mine, Alvin Schwartz, who also wrote a number of stories featuring Superman and Batman (especially for the two heroes' newspaper strips) in the '40's and '50's, including the first appearances of the Superman-Batman team, red kryptonite, and probably Bizarro (none of which he considered terribly good ideas--Bizarro was created by either Schwartz or Otto Binder, depending on whether the newspaper strip or comic book appearance of the character was prepared first). Henry could find a rhyme for anything, though occasionally people with specific accents helped a bit...like a cowboy who managed to rhyme "applesauce" with his "dapple hoss," or a Cockney who found a match for the notorious "orange" with his door 'inge... Time I got back to Oz, isn't it? I agree that GNOME KING, JACK PUMPKINHEAD, and PIRATES are a series, since all feature Peter--but I wouldn't add CAPTAIN SALT to the list, since Peter's not in it. (True, the main characters were introduced in PIRATES, but by that reasoning one could also add PURPLE PRINCE and SILVER PRINCESS, which pick up on characters introduced in JACK PUMPKINHEAD (as well as KABUMPO). And, though I think I've mentioned this before, Thompson had the same problem with Peter that Baum had with Dorothy...he didn't age as much as he should have, while living outside Oz. Peter was 9 in GNOME KING, and 11 two years later in JACK PUMPKINHEAD...so far, so good. But three years later in PIRATES, he was STILL only 11! Did Thompson fudge that for better reader identification? If so, it was rather clumsy, since she specifically stated five years had gone by since GNOME KING! Yet, having learned what I have about Reilly & Lee editors, I suspect Thompson's manuscript actually DID make Peter 14 (Neill draws him about that old...and also wearing a Boy Scout uniform, and at the time Boy Scouts had to be at least 12), and the editor changed him (as s/he did to Jenny Jump later??!!) not realizing how confused that made everything! Rich Morrissey ====================================================================== Date: Wed, 02 Oct 1996 06:48:32 -0700 (PDT) From: Eric Gjovaag Subject: Ozzy Stuff (for da Digest) Someone asked me, "What's the 'Oz Kids Collection'?" Since there may be others wondering, I'll let everyone know here. "The Oz Kids" is a cartoon series produced over the last couple of years by Hyperion Animation, who made "The Brave Little Toaster." The head (forgot his name) is a life-long Oz fan. The series has already been shown abroad (Gili's seen it in Israel, right?), but no American distributor has been found yet, so while they keep looking they're releasing them on video. The stories are based on Baum stories (and not just Oz ones, either), but the characters are the children of all of our old friends. I've seen some of it at Winkies, and it looks like fun. There was an article in the "Seattle Times" last night about Dorothy Gage, the Baum's niece who died in infancy and probably inspired Baum's most famous character. Sally Roesch Wagner, the historian who first made the connection between the two Dorothy's (she wrote the "Bugle" article about it a few years ago) found Dorothy Gage's grave in Bloomington, Illinois. Well, it may take a LOT longer than I thought to get the FAQ on my web site updated, since Laura's been installing Windows 95 on her computer this week, and it's taking longer than she anticipated to get everything up and running smoothly. So, for those of you wondering about the answer to the salary question, sorry, it's going to be a while before you can see for yourself. --Eric Gjovaag # Come visit my "Wizard of Oz" web site! http://www.eskimo.com/~tiktok/ # ====================================================================== Date: Wed, 02 Oct 1996 16:10:58 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Olderman Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-02-96 Help! A teacher friend of mine wants to know the difference between a myth, a folk tale, a fairy tale, and a fable. The fable part isn't too hard, but I don't really know how to answer her. Myth, I guess, deals with "higher powers" and "why is this so?" stuff, but folk tales do that too. Anyone able to clarify? A standard dictionary definition doesn't really do it here, I'm afraid. Tolkien's essay isn't particularly helpful either, IIRC, but I may be wrong. ====================================================================== Date: Wed, 02 Oct 1996 16:13:42 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Olderman Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-02-96 PETER AND THE PRINCESS was written by Carl H. Grabo. ====================================================================== Date: Wed, 02 Oct 1996 14:44:52 -0700 (PDT) From: Peter Hanff Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-02-96 Dave, I'm sorry to report the death of longtime Oz Club member, Gary Kendall. Gary attended the Ozmopolitan meeting in June and enjoyed himself despite the ravages of his wasting illness. I spoke with him by telephone about a month ago and he remained characteristically upbeat and forward looking, although he admitted to being increasingly exhausted. He was a quiet, somewhat shy member of the Oz Club, but those of us who had the privilege of knowing him will long remember his humor, his keen love of things Ozian, and his devotion to his friends, and to his beloved Yugoslavia. Peter ====================================================================== Date: Wed, 02 Oct 1996 18:11:16 -0400 From: DavidXOE@aol.com Subject: Ozzy Digest, 10-02-96 Tyler: Strictly speaking, Zurline is Queen of the Wood Nymphs in SANTA CLAUS; since a Queen of the Fairies is also mentioned (though not named) in that book, it's pretty unlikely that they're the same. (But I suspect Baum was thinking of Zurline when he named the character Lurline in TIN WOODMAN - probably without checking back to the earlier book. He doesn't seem to have made a habit of that.) I think Hesiod is considered more or less "official" Greek mythology as far as he goes, but there are a great many Greek myths from other sources that are also found in compendia like Bulfinch's MYTHOLOGY. There's certainly nothing like the Bible or the Koran that the Greeks believed to have divine inspiration such that anything not in it was of far lesser authority. (This is why the Greeks picked up all sorts of mythological stories from other sources; Adonis, for instance, is based on Semitic fertility gods and the name is from the same root as "Adonai" in Hebrew.) ***************MILD SPOILER FOR GLASS CAT*********************** It's possible that there are multiple passes through the mountains surrounding Oogaboo, but if so, then it would make my having the Bad Lads post guards at the entrance to "the pass" rather pointless. It's pretty clear in GC, if not in QA, that the Oogaboos know of only one pass out of their valley, and they'd surely know of the pass that contained Jodie's forest, so those two passes must be the same, even if there are others. I prefer to think that the forest didn't thrive in the pass (rocky soil isn't really very good for trees), and it was moved sometime during the 40-odd years between the books to a better location. (It may be the forest where Salye was captured, for instance.) ***************END SPOILER************************************* It's true that Peter and Speedy had something to return to in America, where Bob Up didn't, but I know that even when I was a kid I wouldn't have hesitated a New York minute if I'd been offered the chance to stay in Oz, even though I had a loving family to return to. I'd have done my best to get a message to them telling them I was OK so they wouldn't worry, but in a crunch I'd have stayed anyway. (It would be even more true at my current age, where the thought of not aging any further would be irresistible. With a kid like Peter or Speedy that would be much less of a consideration, of course.) But it's true that Thompson would probably have had a harder time selling that. After Trot and Button-Bright, the only children who stayed in Oz in the FF were orphans. (Of course, Peter and Speedy were technically orphans, but they did live with blood relatives.) Well, I take that back. Bucky Jones may or may not have had blood relatives left in America; we don't really know. He had an uncle who owned the tug that exploded and blew him to the Nonestic/Nonentic, but if that uncle was on the tug he might not have been as lucky as Lucky Bucky. And that might have been his only remaining relative. We know Bob Up, Jenny Jump, and Robin Brown were all alone in the world. Nathan: See my last post; even in LOST PRINCESS Baum included some IEs, though fewer than in most of his books. As far as the places in EC are concerned, I think that Cuttenclips, Fuddlecumjigs, Rigmarole Town, and Flutterbudget Center aren't really irrelevant to the plot (such as it is), since the travelers intended to visit those places when they left the EC. Utensia, Bunbury, and Bunnybury, however, along with the zebra and the crab and the careless kangaroo, are IEs, since they are entirely unnecessary to the plot (although Utensia and Bunnybury are more fun than the places they intended to go in the first place). Steve: ****************SPOILER FOR LOST KING************************ I agree with you that LOST KING probably shows Ozma at her worst, but I suspect that suddenly finding out that a father that you'd thought was long-since dead is alive would throw most people into a tizzy for a little while, and the whole period of time from Ozma's first appearance to the end of the book is a matter of a few hours. (Ozma has a footman clear away her breakfast dishes just before the feather arrives instructing them to go to Morrow. They arrive back in the palace and do quite a lot of things before finishing by eating dinner that same day. I'd estimate that Ozma is "on stage" no more than 8-10 hours total, which is a not unreasonable length of time to be in a state of shock. ******************END SPOILER******************************* David Hulan ====================================================================== Date: Wed, 02 Oct 1996 19:17:25 -0400 (EDT) From: Nathan DeHoff Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-02-96 Tyler: In _Santa Claus_, Zurline is the Queen of the Wood-Nymphs, not the Fairies. The Fairy Queen is un-named in that book. Personally, I believe that Lurline, Lulea, and the Fairy Queen in _Santa Claus_ are all the same character. Zurline is someone different. Dave: When is the Locasta story going to be available, and who is publishing it? -Nathan Mulac DeHoff ====================================================================== Date: Wed, 02 Oct 1996 17:18:45 -0700 (PDT) From: Eric Gjovaag Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-02-96 > From: Nathan DeHoff > Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-01-96 > > Eric: > Hope to see the _Queen Ann_ sequel soon! Me, too... > From: DavidXOE@aol.com > Subject: Ozzy Digest, 10-01-96 > > Eric: > It's true that the forest isn't actually moved in the published version of > QUEEN ANN, but Ozma says it will be, and that means it surely happened, > right? Hey, even Ozma may get it wrong at times. There may have been unexpected complications... Oops, Kabumpo's coming, and he looks like he's in a stamping mood... > Rich: > I think it's fairly easy to understand why other Oz writers have returned to > Oogaboo more than to other Oz sites - it's a reasonably complete, well-set-up > small kingdom, and there aren't many of those in PD as yet...Jinxland and the > Hyup country are so isolated that they'd be > difficult... They're no more isolated than Oogaboo. > From: Richard Bauman <72172.2631@CompuServe.COM> > Subject: Today's Growls > > Eric - you have let slip you have a job - the "payday" reference. So is it in > teaching or are you designing WWW pages for a living? Since only two people here have asked (and one or two privately -- to which I privately responded), I'll just assume most people don't want to know and leave it at that for now... --Eric Gjovaag ====================================================================== Date: Wed, 02 Oct 1996 22:41:20 -0400 (EDT) From: Gili Bar-Hillel Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-02-96 Dave - Congrats on new computer! I'm getting one too, I hope on Friday, but I'll be sticking to a Mac (even though my friends think those will soon be obsolete...) Barbara - If you do find out where in Boston that little exhibit will be, do tell! Hmm. I think it would be interesting to have Maguire challenged by someone who is really up on her/his Ozzy history. Jane, have you read his book? In any case, please report to us and tell us what his talk was like! October 19th... there's that date again :-) (my birthday). |\ _,,,---,,_ /,`.-'`' -. ;-;;,_ Gili Bar-Hillel, |,4- ) )-,_..;\ ( `'-' abhillel@fas.harvard.edu '---''(_/--' `-'\_) gili@scso.com http://www.scso.com/~gili ====================================================================== ] c/ \ /___\ *** THE OZZY DIGEST, OCTOBER 4, 1996 *** |@ @| | V | \\\ |\_/| | ;;; \-/ \ ;/ >< ] ============================================================================= Date: Thu, 03 Oct 1996 04:32:38 -0400 From: Tyler Jones <104707.656@compuserve.com> Subject: Ozzy DIgest Nathan: I would welcome any reviews of Buckethead books by you. A rating is not required, of course. I only ask that you either use the one in place now or use nothing. This is not to force people to think like me, but rather to give a uniform scale so that people can get a consensus among people who do rate them. If you choose not to rate books, then that does not apply. To send me a review, just write it up and mail it to me privately. While I accept negative reviews, I ask that you be obejctive in your writing. Steve: The Queen of the Faries is named Zurline in _Santa Claus_. I used to think that Lurline, Zurline and Lulea were all the same person, but I no longer do, since they appear to behave different and have different powers and responsibilities. Aaron, Steve and mythology: I have always been under the impression that mythology is a very hodgepodge collection of stories and tales, many of which contradict each other and sometimes give the same god/goddess different characteristics and manifestations. I do not know if there is an "official" greek mythology against which other stories can be checked. Danny: Your point has been noted before by people, although neve mentioned in the digest, IIRC. Neill's work started to drop off toward the end of RPT and was quite inferior to his early work. David and Nathan: Another possible explanation is that different passes were used in the books. WHile it is mentioned somewhere that there is only one pass in and out of Oogaboo, this information was probably given by the Oogaboos themselves. They rarely if ever leave their country and few visit, so it is possible that there are many passes through the mountains and people may actually use two of them while believing they used the same one! David: Bob Up stayed in Oz because he had nothing to go home to, unlike Peter and Speedy. Button-Bright apparantly had a family, and he even went back to them once, after _Road_, but for some unexplained reason, he stayed after his adventure in _Scarecrow_. Also, I got your message to my old address and you should have recieved my reply. It is strange that my old account still works. They told me that it would be killed two weeks after I started with my new address, and I have been here at least 15 days. However, it may be destroyed at any time, so please if anybody sends me private e-mail, do so at my new address. Ken H: I believe Roquat/Ruggedo was dunked three times in the Fountain, at the end of _Emerald City_, _Magic_ and _Gnome King_. Maybe Rug changed his name on purpose to symbolize his "rebirth" after regaining his memories the first time and saw to reason to change again after his successive dunks. Nathan: MOPPeT is that the gypsies had a spot-protection spell that rendered the sands in their area harmless. Whether you like this one or your theory that the gypsies themselves were protected amounts to the same thing, except that with the second, people cannot visit their lands without the same spell. --Tyler Jones ====================================================================== Date: Thu, 03 Oct 1996 10:01:33 -0400 From: DIXNAM@aol.com Subject: Ozzy Digest 10-3-96 Dave: I second Gili's congrats on your new computer. (But with Windows '95/96 you now have the features of an '85 Mac!) Like David Hulan, I got anxious when the Digest didn't appear for two days in a row. I feared it had gone the way of its predecessors. (:-( Gili: Don't believe what your friends are telling you. Mac's are NOT becoming obsolete. Apple's hierarchy just has to get it's act together. And wasn't your "sleeping cat" done by Felix Lee? Dick Randolph ====================================================================== Date: Thu, 03 Oct 1996 09:07:59 -0700 From: "Stephen J. Teller" Subject: OZ: Thompsonian Series Rich: I feel CAPTAIN SALT should be considered a part of (or at least an appendage to) the Peter series of RPT's books, because it contains on characters who were not *introduced* in PIRATES. Besides that, Captain Salt and Ato discuss the point that Tandy is not the comrade that Peter was. Its only links to Oz are through the Peter books. PURPLE PRINCE and SILVER PRINCESS do have the Red Jinn, who was introduced in JACK PUMPKINHEAD, but they are part of the KABUMPO series (somehow I never considered LOST KING a part of that series even though Kabumpo does play a fairly large role in that book). Anyway, PP especially has many other links to earlier Oz books, unlike C. SALT. SP is clearly a sequel to PP. For those interested in Myth and Language, the Semetic word "Adon," from which both Adonai and Adonis derive, simply means Lord (the opposite of Lady, not THE LORD). The Semetic root for G-d is El. Tyler: You are correct in saying there is no "official" Greek mythology. The text I current use in my mythology class is Powell's CLASSICAL MYTHOLOGY which gives much information on the sources of each myth. The indispensible guide to all the varients on the myths is Robert Graves THE GREEK MYTHS; he gives all the versions of each myth, but his interpretations of the myths are contraversial (fortunately he separates the telling of the myths and the interpretations in each of his 171 chapters). Actually some of my students did not like Graves because they wanted to know "which was the right version." Dave: I just added OZ to my subject line, I hope this makes things easier. BTW I read the 10/3 post before the 10/2 one, it makes things interesting. BTW any Gilbert and Sullivan fans in Ozzy land: I subscribed to the SAVOYNET last Friday and have already received over 100 postings. It bounces the messages directly to the subscribers. I am thinking of dropping it because I have hardly time to skim the postings. My first love remains OZ. Steve T. ====================================================================== Date: Thu, 03 Oct 1996 08:36:10 -0600 (CST) From: Ruth Berman Subject: ozzy digest David Hulan: On artists and deterioration in eyesight -- even without any special eye-troubles, don't most artists start finding it harder to handle minute detail-work when they hit bifocal age? I think I remember seeing an interview in which Pauline Baynes commented on how she could no longer easily do the kind of detailed drawings she had done for the Narnia books. // I think you're right in suggesting that Ozma's tears and excitement in "Lost King" are reasonable reactions in the context of the story -- finding a parent thought long dead is something that would make most people emotional. [more "Lost King" discussion, assuming familiarity with story] Actually, I'm surprised at the amount of dislike some of the digesters have expressed for "Lost King." I'd agree that the death penalty for Mombi is unwarranted, and a flaw in the story, but it seems to me that it's small compared to the story's good qualities -- especially the comic contrasts of the ways both Pajuka and Kabumpo, judging people by appearances, both keep going wrong, but go wrong in opposite directions (Pajuka accepting Humpy as the Lost King, and Kabumpo holding that Humpy has no worthwhile qualities), and Humpy, too, because he keeps judging what he sees by screen cliches, keeps getting appearance and reality mixed up, but in different ways. Kimbaloo, one of RPT's typically royal-and-democratic townlets (with its button-and-bouquet based economy), is attractive, too, and so is getting to know more about the past of Oz. [end discussion assuming familiarity with plot] I had more to say about "Lost King," but I'm not sure if I should go ahead and assume that I should say it if I choose, or wait longer for the Club to use it. I think it's a dead project, and I might as well go ahead and use it myself. It's a bit long for the Digest, but would make a nice contribution for the Oz Research Group, maybe. With Fred still recovering from illness, though, I'm not sure whom to ask. Fred, a few years back, thought it would be a nice project to take the essays that had been written for the Club's reprints of various Oz books, and add in essays on some of the other books, to make up a volume of introductions/essays to be published by the Club. (In fact, the Club paid me for writing mine, which was on "Lost King," so at the time it looked as if the volume was something seriously intended for publication.) Anybody know if this project is still theoretically alive? Gili Bar-Hillel: I haven't seen "Angels in America," but would be interested in knowing about its Oz references, anyway. I remember from reviews of the play that it's about gays, and Judy Garland's Dorothy is something of an icon for gays, who tend to see coming out of the b&w Kansas world into Oz as a metaphor for "coming out of the closet." Which isn't all that relevant to the books, but it's still reasonably interesting. (Or is the topic of gay liberation one that would be too emotional, as likely to result in long digressions, whether pro or con or both, of no direct Oz interest?) Robin Olderman: Yes, Neill's artwork in "Peter and the Princess" is just gorgeous. (Grabo's story isn't particularly interesting, which is a pity.) Most of the time, I think Neill did most of his best artwork in b&w rather than color, but "Peter and the Princess," even more than "Sea Fairies" and "Emerald City," is an exception.// On differences between myth, folk tale, fairy tale, and fable -- they overlap a good deal. Myths are the stories out of a religion system. (In a more general sense, the story of how the Pilgrims and Indians celebrated the First Thanksgiving, although historically accurate -- well, sort of -- is an American culture myth, the story-explaining-a-cult-practice, in this case, the practice of having Thanksgiving dinner.) A fairy tale is one kind of folk tale -- except, of course, that an "art fairy tale" by a single known writer isn't a "folk" tale. In theory, writers could do, say, art-saints-legends or art-town-of-fools stories, but most of the time, writers who've drawn on folk tales have been drawing on fairy tales. (And fables are stories that make clear moral points, but beast-fables tend to shade off into fairy tale.) So you won't find any really clear sets of definitions, with so much overlap, but maybe these comments help a bit. I don't know of any one book that goes into the topic, but your friend might want to look up Marianne Thalman's book on the art fairy tale, introductory chapters of Fraser's "Golden Bough" and Robert Graves' Greek myths, other compendiums of Greek myth, encyclopedias of folklore, and such like. (Tolkien's essay is helpful, too, although you're right that it doesn't include a set of definitions.) ====================================================================== Date: Thu, 03 Oct 1996 11:09:52 -0400 (EDT) From: Nathan DeHoff Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-03-96 David: It is quite true that we do not know if Bucky has any surviving relatives. As far as I can remember, all we know is that his ancestors have been pilots and captains for many generations. The tugboat on which he began the adventure may have belonged to a family member, but all the other passengers might have been killed during the boiler explosion. Button-Bright and Trot both have parents, even though they go to Oz to live. As for Jenny Jump, we know nothing about her family, but the book does state that she lived alone. How did she support herself, or buy the pepper-cheese? Also, we do not know about Betsy Bobbin's family. Her family might have been on the ship when it sank. -N. M. D. ====================================================================== Date: Thu, 03 Oct 1996 13:55:22 -0400 From: DavidXOE@aol.com Subject: Ozzy Digest, 10-03-96 Rich: I bow to your superior knowledge of the comics field. I remembered the rhyming cop, and the name Clancy, but was obviously wrong in joining them. (Hey, it was 50 years ago, more or less, and I'm not a comics fan; I just read them when I was a kid.) Besides the uniform Neill shows, Peter specifically says that he's a Scout in PIRATES, and you're right, they had to be at least 12 in those days. (One reason I was never very active in Boy Scouts myself was that the year I turned 12 was the year they lowered the age to 11, so that I got in at the same time as a bunch of Little Kids and it wasn't as much fun...) I suppose it's theoretically possible Peter was just a Cub Scout, if they had Cubs as far back as 1930; I don't know about that. But he certainly acts more like a 13-14-year-old in PIRATES than an 11-year-old. Robin: I don't know about the technical definitions, if there are any, but given an example I can recognize whether I consider it a myth, a folk tale, or a fairy tale (or possibly more than one). To be a myth, I think that some fairly substantial group of people at some point in time had to believe that the story was literally true. (And the people who are talking about it have to believe that it isn't literally true.) Folk tales and fairy tales aren't mutually exclusive; some stories, like "Snow White" for instance, are both. Folk tales are anonymous stories that have been handed down by oral tradition for at least part of their history; they may or may not include supernatural elements. Fairy tales are a little harder to separate from fantasy in general; Tolkien gave a definition in his essay, but I'm not sure that it either includes everything that most people think of when they hear the term "fairy tale", or excludes everything that they don't. For one thing, I don't think Tolkien anticipated the enormous efflorescence of adult fantasy that, to a considerable degree, he inspired. Books like de Camp's THE GOBLIN TOWER and Asprin's ANOTHER FINE MYTH probably meet all of Tolkien's criteria, but I don't think they qualify as fairy stories. I am not, however, a literary expert in any sense of the word. I just read a lot and think about it some. But I don't often read what other people think on the same subjects, so I don't know if there's any kind of consensus among those who do. Maybe Steve or Ken S. or someone else with an advance degree in English Lit can shed some light. Nathan: Since Dave didn't answer you himself, LOCASTA is going to be published by Buckethead when BEOO has enough money to finance it and it reaches the top of the queue. So buy lots of Buckethead books and it'll come out sooner. (If there's more definite information on the subject it'll have to come from Chris D. or Dave.) Eric: I was just doing a little MIKADO allusion there; I realize that in fact Ozma can say something will happen and then it doesn't. I consider Jinxland and the Hyup country more isolated than Oogaboo. You can get to Oogaboo on foot, and people have done so both in and out of the FF. Jinxland and the Hyup country, however, are only accessible by air or magic. David Hulan ====================================================================== Date: Thu, 03 Oct 1996 13:09:15 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Olderman Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-03-96 Eric wrote: >>Someone asked me, "What's the 'Oz Kids Collection'?" Since there may be others wondering, I'll let everyone know here. "The Oz Kids" is a cartoon series produced over the last couple of years by Hyperion Animation, who made "The Brave Little Toaster." The head (forgot his name) is a life-long Oz fan. The series has already been shown abroad (Gili's seen it in Israel, right?), but no American distributor has been found yet, so while they keep looking they're releasing them on video. Willard Carroll is the life-long Oz fan you refer to. "The Oz Kids" will be released on TV in '98, per Hyperion's agreement with Paramount, IIRC. David: I wonder how many of us will respond about that statement of Trot's being an orphan. She lived with her mother. ====================================================================== Date: Thu, 03 Oct 1996 15:02:48 -0400 From: Tyler Jones <104707.656@compuserve.com> Subject: Ozzy Digest David and Eric: Ozma mentioning that the forest *will* be moved is sufficient to make me believe that it will be (or was, from our time's perspective). I use a similar example from _Land_ when discussing Mombi's magical strength. Near the end of _Land_, Glinda says that after Mombi restores Ozma, she will force Mombi to drink a poition which will eliminate Mombi's magical power. While we do not actually witness the drinking, it is unlikely that Glinda forgot to do this and I assume that after that story, Mombi no longer has any magical power. David: With luck, we will see some Pumperdinkian stories within a year and a half. --Tyler Jones ====================================================================== Date: Thu, 03 Oct 1996 13:13:09 +0200 From: Bill Wright Subject: Received the following email at my Ozzy website. Think it should be of interest to Digest members. Please respond directly to Elizabeth (unless she becomes a member of the Digest.........Dave??) Thanks, Bill in Ozlo -----------begin message--------- I am an English teacher, and am going to teach the Wizard of Oz as a semester theme to my limited English students. I've been searching everywhere on the web. Finally found your wonderful site but would love to find someone who has a copy of the 2 movies done by NBC and ABC about Baum. We've called NBC to get a tape of it but no one seems to be able to help us. I bet an Oz fan might have it somewhere out there. We're going to make our 8th grade kids Oz maniacs - and would even like to see an Oz pen pal email club possible from your site. Thanks Elizabeth Blackadar lizstull@fia.net ====================================================================== Date: Thu, 03 Oct 1996 20:30:29 -0400 (EDT) From: Richard Bauman <72172.2631@CompuServe.COM> Subject: TODAY'S OZ GROWLS RICH - It is all in the way it is presented for me. Regarding the "footpath." Dorothy clicks her heels and is transported by magic. I don't have a bit of trouble with that. RPT creates this bridge with legs, people climb on it and the thing takes off for the EC at over 2100 mph. I have trouble with that. To me that is just silly, not magic. IMHO. David - You would have stayed in Oz? Where would you find any books to read? Particularly mysteries! I don't recall ever seeing any in Oz. What good would it be to live forever if there is nothing new to read? Ah, I see another book for you - "The Authors of Oz." :) Scientifically, Bear (:<) ====================================================================== Date: Thu, 03 Oct 1996 22:27:39 -0400 From: Tyler Jones <104707.656@compuserve.com> Subject: Ozzy Digest Rich: Your theory that Rug regained his memory on his own, as opposed to being "re-educated" by his fellow Nomes, is boslerted by the fact that he regained his memory and personality after _MAgic_ while living in the Emerald City, surrounded by Ozites. Of course, someone suggested that Glegg secretly restored his memories as part of his plan in _Kabumpo_. According to HACC theory, Peter and Speedy were 9 in their debut books and 13 in their final books in the FF, which is why the dates of occurence for those books are not compressed the wasy the first part of the series is. Eric: Oh, No! Windows 95! I myself spent an entire weekend getting the thing going, so I know how much fun you guys are going to have :-) Also, I'll add my plea fo you to inform the digest of your new job and start the ball rolling by saying that I have rejoined the ranks of the employed as a software designer for a viedo-conferencing compnay. Robin: ***** Random thoughts only, nothing "official" ***** myth: a story involving "powers", as they are called in D&D. Usually stories about creation or stories about the lives of the gods after creation. Folk Tale: A story involving the culture, people and/or legends of the local area. fable: a completely made-up story, with some sort of lesson or moral to be learned at the end. Fairy Tale: a story involving magic, fairies and other "mythical" creatures, but rarely gods and such. Kind of like Sci-Fi/Fantasy lite. ***** End of ramblings and off-the-top-of-my-head-guesses ***** Nathan: I agree that Lulea and the fairy queen in _Santa Claus_ are the same, but I believe that Lurline is different. Despite both being from Burzee, they seem to have different responsiblities and powers. There may be many bands of fairies that are all slightly different, and while I beleive that Lulea, Lurline and Zurline are three different people, I believe they all know each other and are related as immortal beings, under the Supreme Master. Eric: While Oogaboo, Jinxland and the Hyup country are more or less equally isolated, Baum fleshed out Oogaboo more so than the Hyups. However, we do know a fair amount about Jinxland. Of course, since the Hyup country has barely been mentioned, a person could really expand it for us. Gili: It would be interesting if someone asked Maguire where he came up with all of these wonderful ideas for his book and what his response would be. --Tyler Jones ====================================================================== Date: Friday 04-Oct-96 08:55:43 From: Dave Hardenbrook Subject: Ozzy Things MY _LOCASTA_ BOOK: As David Hulan said, Buckethead will publish my book _Locasta and the Three Adepts of Oz_ as soon as Chris has the finances to do it. But _Locasta_ is pretty far down on Chris' current queue of books to go to press, and since he has to raise the funds to print each book in turn, I'm not optimistic that the book will be ready before Reera and Glenn's silver wedding anniversary ( unless someone cares to make a generous contribution to fund Chris' endevours??? :) ). OZ BADGE UPDATE: After many delays, I'm almost finished with the design for the Ozzy Digest Badge/tee-shirt, and I will send it Barbara for printing. BOOKS IN OZ: Bear wrote: >You would have stayed in Oz? Where would you find any books to read? Try Glinda's Great Library of Knowledge or the Wogglebug College Library. RUG'S MEMORY: There has been so much arguement about how Ruggedo regained his memory that I can't resist letting everyone in on what REALLY happpened (But be forewarned -- If you don't want *any* of _Locasta_ spoiled for you, DON'T READ THIS!): ********** SPOILER FOR _LOCASTA AND THE THREE ADEPTS OF OZ_ ********** After his memory loss at the end of _Magic_, Ruggedo lived happily as a friend of Oz until he found a spray can ( I'm NOT going to go into here how a spray can got into 1920's Oz :) ) and sprayed it, releasing Taarna the Terrible, an All-Powerful Genie. Taarna was once a major threat to Oz until Mombi (of all people!) imprisoned her in the spray can. As you may have surmised, Taarna longs to avenge her long imprisonment by devestating Oz! But she is the slave of her liberator, Ruggedo, who has no ambition to harm Oz, his having lost his memory and now being a "wimpo goody-goody". So Taarna's only chance is to make Ruggedo use one of his three wishes of the genie to make himself evil again, so that he'll command Taarna to conquer Oz. So after a lot of cajoling and intimidation, she finally persuades Ruggedo to wish for his memory to be restored, which she does, and also renders him permanently immune to the Water of Obilvion. But the now-evil Ruggedo, seeing Taarna as a rival, immediately stuffs Taarna back into her can, throws it into a gravel pit, and marches off to write his history in rock (thus begins _Kabumpo_). Only many years later (when most of my story takes place) does Ruggedo and Taarna's paths once again cross, and they finally form an alliance. *********************** END SPOILER ********************************** GILBERT AND SULLIVAN IN OZ: Steve T. wrote: >I subscribed to the SAVOYNET last Friday and have already >received over 100 postings ... I am thinking of dropping it >because I have hardly time to skim the postings. My >first love remains OZ. I too am a member of SAVOYNET, but frequently delete it unread because I just don't have the time to read it...Oz is top priority for me as well! :) -- Dave ====================================================================== ] c/ \ /___\ *** THE OZZY DIGEST, OCTOBER 5, 1996 *** |@ @| | V | \\\ |\_/| | ;;; \-/ \ ;/ >< ] ============================================================================= Date: Fri, 04 Oct 1996 12:50:21 +0200 From: Bill Wright I have received a request from a high school looking to find the script and songs to put on a WizOz play this year. Could someone send me an email of the name and address of where they should go to obtain this. I know this has been posted on the Digest sometime in the past, put silly me, I forgot to note it somewhere I could find it easily. Bill in Oz ====================================================================== Date: Fri, 04 Oct 1996 13:03:29 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Olderman Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-04-96 Thanks for the help about myth, folk tale, and fairytale. I'm going to copy all of your comments into a ClarisWorks document and give it to my friend. The boundaries do blur, don't they. ====================================================================== Date: Fri, 04 Oct 1996 15:12:24 -0400 From: DavidXOE@aol.com Subject: Ozzy Digest 10-04-96 Ruth: You're probably right - I'm not an artist (of the type who draws pictures, at least), so I've no idea how the general aging process would affect the ability to draw fine detail. I like LOST KING quite a lot; it's my favorite of the early Thompsons by a considerable margin. I don't think she wrote anything as good before YELLOW KNIGHT, or possibly even OJO. It has flaws, but so does every Oz book with the possible exception of MERRY-GO-ROUND (which I think is the best-crafted of the FF but which, to me, doesn't have a very Ozzy feel to it). That collection of essays/introductions to all the Oz books sounds like a really good project for the Club, though I'm not sure there'd be enough demand for it to justify printing it with a full binding and such. But if the authors would contribute their services for free, it should be possible to photocopy it so it could sell for only a few dollars, and so it could be reprinted easily as copies ran out without a serious capital investment. (I'm thinking something more along the lines of FANCYCLOPEDIA II than THE WIZARD OF WAY-UP.) Nathan: The tug whose boiler blew up and threw Bucky into the Oz universe did belong to his uncle, though it's not clear whether or not he was on the boat when the explosion happened. Robin: I didn't say Trot was an orphan. She not only had a living mother, but a living father, at least in SKY ISLAND; he succeeded Cap'n Bill as captain of the ship they'd both sailed on after Cap'n Bill lost his leg. I said, "After Trot and Button-Bright, the only children who stayed in Oz in the FF were orphans." Trot and Button-Bright weren't orphans, we don't know about Betsy, and Dorothy, though an orphan, had a family she was devoted to. But all the children -after- Trot and Button-Bright who stayed were orphans. (At least, I assume Jenny was an orphan because she lived alone. Maybe it was just that she had such a bad temper her parents kicked her out...) Bear: I have great confidence that there are plenty of books to read in Oz. And when I was a kid, I was much less selective in what I was willing to read. Hey, I even read a thing or two by Dickens back then before my tastes firmed up! :-) Tyler: Glad to hear that you're back among the employed! (Not that I don't find -not- being among the employed quite delightful, myself, but then I don't need to be employed to eat...) All: Well, I'm off out of town for the next five days; I'll probably be back in time to read the accumulated Digests Wednesday, but it'll be Thursday or maybe later before I have time to respond to them. Au revoir! David Hulan ====================================================================== Date: Fri, 04 Oct 1996 15:33:25 -0400 From: Tyler Jones <104707.656@compuserve.com> Subject: Ozzy Digest It looks like I accidentally sent a post twice. This may have been due to a temporary glitch that created a delay in sending mail, but I believe that has been fixed, so you will only see my words once. Nathan: In some Buckethead book, it is mentioned that Betsy's parents have been transported to Oz, although they are very minor characters. Speaking of this, we have been talking about BEOO publising Oz books. Chris relies on sales of earlier Oz books to finance publication of new Oz books. You can go to my web page and see all of the available BEOO books and reviews of some of them, which you can add to by writing a review and mailing it to me. Dave and Bill: It would be cool to get that English Teacher (and by extension, her 8th grade class) on the digest. Bear: I'm sure that if you asked Ozma sweetly, she would provide a library for you that magically updates itself every now and then. Also, in _Patchwork Girl_, Dorothy is reading a book in Chapter 16. In the Laumerian Oz, Ozma magically created a library for the Wogglebug and his college. All: I specifically avoided Dave's explanation of Rug's memory, so I will also avoid theorizing on it anymore and I would like to beg everyone who DID read the post to keep mum about it for a while, please :-) --Tyler Jones ====================================================================== Date: Fri, 04 Oct 1996 17:20:33 -0400 (EDT) From: Nathan DeHoff Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-04-96 Steve: I agree that _Lost King_ does not really seem to be part of the Kabumpo series. He is more of a "special guest star," as Humpy might say. Ruth: _Lost King_ is actually one of my favorite Oz books. It is sometimes a little tough to keep track of the multiple plots, though. Even Thompson has some trouble with this. When Dorothy meets the Scooters, one of these rivermen says, "It's only ten o'clock." After she leaves the Scooters, she meets Kabumpo. That same morning, at "nearly nine o' clock," Snip awakens in Blankenburg, and soon learns from Tora that, "An elephant has run off with a little girl." Unless it takes Snip an hour to reach Tora's shop, which seems quite unlikely, there is a mistake here (not too major, I'll admit, but somewhat annoying). David: Jinxland may not be as isolated today as it was in the time of _Scarecrow_. In _Grampa_, the Army of Ragbad marches to Jinxland, and they probably do not have any magic to help them cross the Great Gulf. Is it possible that a bridge was built over the Gulf? Bear: There are probably plenty of books in Oz. The ones that grow on trees might be inconvenient, as they wither once read. However, the Public Library of Oz probably has quite a collection, and, if Umbrella Island ever visits Oz, you could always borrow some from Gureeda. --Nathan M. DeHoff ====================================================================== Date: Fri, 04 Oct 1996 16:20:45 -0700 From: Robert.Shepherd@West.Sun.COM (Bob Shepherd) Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-04-96 Hi All - It seems that a day doesn't go by without hearing some reference to Oz! Just yesterday I heard Paul Harvey on the radio say that the #1 video that people are buying to keep is (you guessed it) _The Wizard of Oz_ (isn't that wonderful?). Going home I heard an advertisement for a video store chain (Hollywood Video) that used a Judy Garland impersonator that started out with "There's no place like Hollywood Video, there's no place like Hollywood Video!", continued on with various other references to the movie, and concluded with "Toto, I don't think we're in just any ol' video store anymore!" It's amazing how much Oz has been woven into our everyday culture and lexicon. Bob Shepherd ====================================================================== Date: Fri, 04 Oct 1996 21:13:33 -0400 (EDT) From: Richard Bauman <72172.2631@CompuServe.COM> Subject: TODAY'S OZ GROWLS Ruth - Your question about the Oz Research Group is curious? See as follows: Date: Thu, 05 Sep 1996 10:07:12 -0600 (CST) From: Ruth Berman Subject: ozzy digest Regarding previous discussion of Cheeriobed as the King of the Munchkins -- it dawns on me that I never did print the article I wrote on the subject several years back anywhere. It's rather too long to contribute to the Digest, but I've typed it up with some revisions and sent it to the Oz Research Group for their fall (post office) mailing. There's a good deal of overlap between the Digest and the OzRG, but in case there are some here who would enjoy it and are not in it -- it's run by Andrea Kelman Yussman, 2800 Rockhaven Ave, Louisville KY 40220. Archivally speaking, Bear (:<) ====================================================================== Date: Fri, 04 Oct 1996 22:07:20 -0400 (EDT) From: Gili Bar-Hillel Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-03-96 Rich Morrissey: That little digression about comics was a perfect example of how interesting digresstions can be... you seem to ahve fascinating friends! Robin: Myth, folktale, fairy tale or fable are sometimes used interchangeably, so dfining them can get a bit confusing. Here's my best shot: MYTH: a. a story with religious significance, usually part of a larger canon or mythology, esp. Greek mythology. As you yourself suggested, myths often serve to explain why the world is so. b. any story or tale that is part of a common cultural heritage, not neceassarily religious. In this sense, The Wizard of Oz is a myth, because it has so infiltrated American society that images from it serve as cultural icons. (which needs further explanation, but I think you get the idea). FOLK TALE: Stories belonging to an oral tradition that is passed down from generation to generation. Folk tales seldom deal with gods, and are more likely to deal with common people or with animals than myths are. However, like the looser sense of myths, Folktales reflect a common cultural heritage. Fairy Tales: Folk tales that have been written down, esp. the flowery type of folktales dealing with princesses and fairies as favoured by Charles Perrault (sp?). Fairy Tales are more closely linked with the modern "fantasy" genre than folktales, but, again, folktales and fairy tales are often interchangeable. FABLES: stories with an allegorical meaning and a moral. Esp. those written by Aesop. These are very loose definitions of course, based more on my intuition than on my academic knowledge. Again, these terms are often used interchangeably. I haven't even finished reading yesterday's digest, not to mention today's, but I've got to go now so that looks like all for today! Gili |\ _,,,---,,_ /,`.-'`' -. ;-;;,_ Gili Bar-Hillel, |,4- ) )-,_..;\ ( `'-' abhillel@fas.harvard.edu '---''(_/--' `-'\_) gili@scso.com http://www.scso.com/~gili ====================================================================== Date: Sat, 05 Oct 1996 04:47:47 +0000 From: Scott Olsen Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-04-96 Re: Ruth's essay on Lost King: I think it would be a great idea to see all the essays published in a single volume. I look forward to seeing yours someday, in one form or another. Michael Hearn's essay about RPT/Ozoplaning that appeared awhile back in the Bugle was excellent. Re: Like/Dislike of Lost King: I'm afraid I'm one of those who, if asked to name their favorite 14 Oz books, would name the 14 Baum books first. (I even like the "boring" parts in Emerald City...) But, for what it's worth, I remember quite a while back none other than the late great Oz historian, Fred Otto, telling me that Lost King was one of his favorites, if not THE favorite of the FF. I've always preferred Kabumpo. So much for the "Thompson got better with the later books" theory. (Although I personally cannot accept most of the premise of Royal Book.) Sincerely, Scott Olsen ====================================================================== Date: Sat, 05 Oct 1996 00:05:33 -0500 From: International Wizard of Oz Club Subject: RE: Paper products Offhand I don't know what is currently available, but Hallmark does = license some of the movie art and photographs. I'm forwarding your = question to the "Ozzy Digest" mailing list in hopes of a more complete = response. Sincerely yours, Jim Vander Noot ---------- From: HBurton739@aol.com Sent: Tuesday, October 01, 1996 10:23 PM To: iwoc@neosoft.com Subject: Paper products I live in Louisville, Ky. and am having a birthday party for my three = year old daughter. She wants Wizard of Oz paper products for her party such = as plates, napkins and cups. I can't find them anywhere. Do they make = them? If so, would you please tell me where I might find or order them? I'm running out of time. HELP! Thanks. HBurton@AOL.com ====================================================================== Date: Sat, 05 Oct 1996 00:09:41 -0500 From: International Wizard of Oz Club Subject: RE: (no subject) Lauren, That's a good question. The two printed copies of the screen play that = I have merely refer to the guards chanting without any specific text. = I'm sending a copy of your note to the Oz mailing list in hopes of a = better answer. Sincerely, Jim Vander Noot ---------- From: Lauren Deane Sent: Tuesday, October 01, 1996 7:59 AM To: info@ozclub.org Subject: (no subject) Hi! I am writing from an elementary school in Pennsylvania. We need confirmation on a triva question about the movie version of the Wizard of Oz. When the guards are entering the witch's castle...what are=20 they chanting? Can you help? Thanks, Lauren Deane- Media Specialist Oak Lane Day School oaklane@pond.com ====================================================================== Date: Sat, 05 Oct 1996 00:22:40 -0500 From: International Wizard of Oz Club Subject: RE: suggestions Hi, Allie's mom, I just returned from vacation and got your note. It sounds like lots of = fun! (Pin the tail on the Cowardly Lion?) I realize it's pretty late = in the game, but I'm passing this along to a group of Oz fans for = comment. Sincerely, Jim Vander Noot ---------- From: TristonJ@aol.com Sent: Friday, September 27, 1996 9:02 PM To: info@ozclub.org Subject: suggestions Hi Folks, My daughter is turning 6 in a few weeks. We are having a Wizard of Oz = Bday party. She is really excited as her mind is afire with Oz ideas--some = not too practical nor easily to actualize. I'm writing to request any suggestions you may have in terms of activities (girls love crafts), = games, favors etc...I did get some intersting thoughts while online regarding a ruby/emerald/ and yellow theme, and the party girl will be all dressed = as Dorothy. We've made invitations and have preliminary ideas. Our quite lengthy brick walkway is being "shaded" yellow as we speak--let's hope = it doesn't rain!) Any advice would be terrific. Thanks in advance. And..... If anyone there gets a chance, an E-mail from your Club would be a = memorable extra on that day!!! (Allie turns 6 on 10/10/96: Her party is on = 10/6/96) Allie's mom ====================================================================== ] c/ \ /___\ *** THE OZZY DIGEST, OCTOBER 6, 1996 *** |@ @| | V | \\\ |\_/| | ;;; \-/ \ ;/ >< ] ============================================================================= Date: Sat, 05 Oct 1996 07:07:07 -0700 (PDT) From: Eric Gjovaag Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-05-96 > From: Bill Wright > > I have received a request from a high school looking to find the script > and songs to put on a WizOz play this year. Could someone send me an > email of the name and address of where they should go to obtain this. I > know this has been posted on the Digest sometime in the past, put silly > me, I forgot to note it somewhere I could find it easily. I have no idea if they have an e-mail address, but the amateur stage rights are held by Tams-Whitmark. IT shouldn't be too hard to find their address in the drama section of any decent-sized library. > From: International Wizard of Oz Club > Subject: RE: (no subject) > > Lauren, > > That's a good question. The two printed copies of the screen play that = > I have merely refer to the guards chanting without any specific text. = > I'm sending a copy of your note to the Oz mailing list in hopes of a = > better answer. Don't bother now, gang. I got the same question (from the same person), and answered it already. And it WILL be appearing in version 1.1 of my FAQ, if I can ever get around to that @#$!! upgrade... BTW, the chant IS printed on page 111 of the Delta Books version of the screenplay, published in 1989, edited and with an introduction by Michael Patrick Hearn. --Eric Gjovaag ====================================================================== Date: Sat, 05 Oct 1996 12:53:02 -0400 (EDT) From: Nathan DeHoff Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-05-96 Regarding Betsy's Family: In Ryan Gannaway's _Time-Travelling in Oz_, it is stated that Betsy's immediate family was blown away in a tornado, and that she was sailing to England, where her relatives lived, when the storm that brought her to the Rose Kingdom occurred. "Bobbin" certainly sounds like an English name, but access to the Nonestic Ocean is usually gained through the Pacific, and it seems rather doubtful that a ship would be sailing to England across the Pacific. I have recently finished reading _The Crocheted Cat in Oz_, a book published by Buckethead Enterprises. I may have a review for the Digest soon. --Nathan M. DeHoff ====================================================================== Date: Sat, 05 Oct 1996 17:20:12 -0400 (EDT) From: Richard Bauman <72172.2631@CompuServe.COM> Subject: Today's Oz Growls Tyler/Nathan - Glad to hear there will be something to read when I get there. Baum hadn't enlightened me. As you know I am still working through RPT. It will be a long time until Laumer. Tyler - Let me know if March 28th arrived and was received. Weekend regards, Bear (:<) ====================================================================== Date: Sat, 05 Oct 1996 17:30:47 -0400 (EDT) From: Gili Bar-Hillel Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-04-96 Hi digest and party parents! I think that the questions Jim has forwarded to us have been asked often enought to merit being added to Ozzy FAQs everywhere. I. The party question: My child wants the Wizard of Oz as a party theme.Any suggestions? did anyone keep the suggestion that came in about six months ago? I remember a girl who was twelve or eleven had some absolutely marvellous ideas - I don't remember her name! Here's a list of the ideas that I do remember: 1. Using Ozzy colors: green for emerald city, yellow blue red and purple for the counties. 2. "pin the tail on the cowardly lion" 3. Frothy pink good witch shake, dark green bad witch punch. 4. Decorating with poppies and sunflowers (how about little bunches of straw, tin funnels, and pawprints?) 5. Decorating paper cups and name cards with Ozzy stickers (such as those printed by Dover) 6. Invitations on Ozzy greeting cards or postcards (with Georgia O'Keefe poppy stamps?) 7. Specially decorated cake, either bakery made after an existing illustration, or just use yellow icing to make a path and stick plastic dolls on it. 8. I like the idea of chalking the path to the house yellow! 9. Using the "cut out and fold" emerald city diorama desgined by Dick Martin and Published by Dover (If you can find it!) as a centerpiece for the table. 10. Dressing up as Dorothy is easy: braids, blue checked dress and a toy dog. Most costume shops have Dorothy costumes. Shoes could be wrapped in generous quantities of tinfoil, or red shoes, depending on which version of Oz you prefer (book or movie). 11. Face painting: Lion is your basic cat, scarecrow is a colored nose and big circles round the eyes, tin man could have jaws outlined in black and little circles for bolts at the hinges, and Dorothy is just lipstick and pink cheeks or something cute like that. Specifically for Allie's mom, who asked about Ozzy crafts: I know there are a lot of Ozzy stickers and rubber stamps out there. At one of the Oz Club conventions Kids were using those to make Ozzy bookmarks out of strips of thick white paper: they punched holes on top and tied little pieces of green ribbon in them to make them look fancier. Dorothy had a basket she carried around in the book: maybe get some of those plastic berry baskets from a supermarket, and have the girls weave colored yarn through the holes to make a basket like Dorothy's. II. What are the Winkie guards chanting in the movie? We should givethe official answer as in the filmscript edited by Michael Hearn (Eric,could you look that up again?) which is the nonsense syllables; mention the similarity to the song of the Volga boatmen; and give the cute variants that some people prefer: "All we own, we owe her!" etc. and in response to other digest postings: Dick Randolph - YES! Thank you. How come you remembered who designed my cat, and I didn't? :-) Tyler - what does "boslerted" mean? For once in my life, I wasn't even able to guess at your original intent... |\ _,,,---,,_ /,`.-'`' -. ;-;;,_ Gili Bar-Hillel, |,4- ) )-,_..;\ ( `'-' abhillel@fas.harvard.edu '---''(_/--' `-'\_) gili@scso.com (cat by Felix Lee) http://www.scso.com/~gili ====================================================================== Date: Saturday 05-Oct-96 22:37:01 From: Dave Hardenbrook Subject: Ozzy Things Thanks Gili! I may add the answers you contributed to the next FAQ... :) I accidentially destroyed my master copies of the Digest for October 4 & 5! Could someone please send them to me so I can forward them to those who have requested them? -- Dave ====================================================================== ] c/ \ /___\ *** THE OZZY DIGEST, OCTOBER 7, 1996 *** |@ @| | V | \\\ |\_/| | ;;; \-/ \ ;/ >< ] ============================================================================= Date: Sun, 06 Oct 1996 03:36:30 -0400 From: Tyler Jones <104707.656@compuserve.com> Subject: Ozzy Digest Nathan: What you say is very true. While it is not excruciatingly important that Dorothy punch a clock on her adventures, it does help the story if things like that add up. Little things still count, if only a little bit. :-) Nathan again: I like the idea of a bridge over the gulf to Jinxland. Not only is it possible, it is quite probable. Before, the king had a reason to want his country isolated. Nowadays, with a good ruler, they would probably want more contact with the main body of Oz, and I'm sure Glinda or the Wizard could easily construct a bridge or two. As far as I know, there has only been one non-FF book concerning Jinxland. This is _The Gardeners Boy of Oz_, one of the best BEOO books ever. Sadly, it is out of print. Maybe Chris remembers if this story mentioned a bridge. Hyup: We started by discussing the relative isolation of Oogaboo, Jinxland and the Hyup country. At the end of _Magic_, Kiki Aru stayed at EC, and I do not believe Ozma made any effort to locate his country. Therefore, it is highly likely that the Hyup country is as isolated and forgotten as ever. --Tyler Jones ====================================================================== Date: Sun, 06 Oct 1996 07:16:12 -0700 (PDT) From: Eric Gjovaag Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-06-96 > From: Gili Bar-Hillel > Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-04-96 > > Hi digest and party parents! > I think that the questions Jim has forwarded to us have been asked > often enought to merit being added to Ozzy FAQs everywhere. How about "The Wizard of Oz Party Book"? (No, *I* don't want to write it...) > II. What are the Winkie guards chanting in the movie? > > We should givethe official answer as in the filmscript edited by Michael Hearn > (Eric,could you look that up again?) which is the nonsense syllables; mention > the similarity to the song of the Volga boatmen; and give the cute > variants that some people prefer: "All we own, we owe her!" etc. Except for the "Volga Boatman" reference, all this WILL be up on my web site very soon, perhaps even tonight. Dave (and anyone else), you have my permission to copy my answer and put it in your FAQ. --Eric "So how do you like my new .sig?" Gjovaag ### Visit my "Wizard of Oz" web site! http://www.eskimo.com/~tiktok/ ### "Get out the time-fracture wickets, Hobbes! We're gonna play Calvinball!" --Calvin, "It's a Magical World," page 99 ====================================================================== Date: Sun, 06 Oct 1996 16:09:04 -0400 From: DIXNAM@aol.com Subject: Ozzy Digest 10-6-96 Gili: My remembering the designer of your "sleeping cat" is one of those things peculiar to us 'seasoned' citizens. Of course I can't remember what I ate for dinner last night, or where was an hour ago. I think it's called "Old-timers" disease! (:-) Dick Randolph ====================================================================== Date: Sun, 06 Oct 1996 21:11:33 -0400 From: Tyler Jones <104707.656@compuserve.com> Subject: Ozzy DIgest Nathan: Most of the time, people go to Oz through the Pacific. If you subscribe to the Chris Dulabone/March Laumer theory, which states that Oz is physically on our planet and somewhere in the south pacific, then it is a little hard to get there from the Atlantic, where Betsy's ship probably would be if it was headed to England. If, however, you adhere to the other theroy, that Oz is in a parallel Earth, or perhaps a gravity well attached to Earth, then entrance to Oz may be had anywhere on our world with equal ease. Once you write your review of _Crocheted Cat_, would you alow me to post it on my web site? The same goes for all other people who have read BEOO books. Gili: The young lady's name was Katy Lau from Hawaii. Her comments were in the last few days of March. I no longer have these, but Bear is sending them to me slowly. THe 28th has been cut in half due to my habit of going off-line too quickly, but perhaps Bear himself may be inclined to look in those digests and find Katy's comments? BTW, boslerted is old Ozzish for bolstered, as in someone's theory was bolstered by other evidence from the FF. Dave: I have re-sent the 10-05 digest, still in original form, so you will get two sets of those wonderful internet headers. Prepare for 10-04, which I will copy from the October block. --Tyler Jones ====================================================================== Date: Monday 07-Oct-96 01:15:18 From: Dave Hardenbrook Subject: Ozzy Things Thanks to everyone who sent me copies of the 10-4 and 10-5 Digests as I requested...Now could th epeople who requested them from ME remind me who you are? :) Today's could be the shortest Digest ever!(?) -- Dave ====================================================================== ] c/ \ /___\ *** THE OZZY DIGEST, OCTOBER 8, 1996 *** |@ @| | V | \\\ |\_/| | ;;; \-/ \ ;/ >< ] ===================================================================== Date: Mon, 07 Oct 1996 09:32:45 -0400 (EDT) From: Nathan DeHoff Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-07-96 Dick: Actually, I am still quite young, and my long-term memory is often better than my short-term. Tyler: In "Much Ado About Kiki Aru," a story in the 1986 Oziana, Bini Aru leaves Mount Munch to search for his son, and eventually finds him. If this account is correct, then Ozma may have established relations with Mount Munch. --Nathan M. DeHoff ====================================================================== Date: Mon, 07 Oct 1996 06:34:52 -0700 (PDT) From: Eric Gjovaag Subject: OZ stuff Dave, I was one of those who needed the 10/4 Digest. Everybody, the FAQ part of my web page is FINALLY up-to-date, and now everyone can read version 1.1. Next step fpr me is to set up my FTP site so it has stuff in it and people can download from it, then I'm going to add some pictures, then I hope to work on version 1.2 this summer. And yes, I did get all five "Oz Kids Collection" videotapes this weekend. --Eric "Now if I could only find time to WATCH them..." Gjovaag ### Visit my "Wizard of Oz" web site! http://www.eskimo.com/~tiktok/ ### ====================================================================== Date: Mon, 07 Oct 1996 09:23:24 -0600 (CST) From: Ruth Berman Subject: ozzy digest Bill Wright asked about script and songs to put on "Wizard of Oz" play, and Eric Gjovaag replied Witmark. A thought in case the high school would like some additional options -- the Samuel French company formerly published (non-musical) adaptations of "Wizard," "Land," "Ozma," and, surprisingly enough, "Enchanted Island of Yew." All are out of print, but they might perhaps be willing to sell photocopies (or be willing to grant permission to have photocopies made if a library to hand has copies). Come to think of it, their "Wizard" is so old that it must be approaching public domain. I wonder if the Club would have any interest in reprinting it when that happens. (I do have copies of these myself, so will try to remember to take a look at dates.) The Children's Theater Company of Minneapolis put on a musical version of "Land" some years back (some of you may have seen the videotape of it they produced). I don't know what their policies are on granting permissions to use their scripts, although I know of at least one occasion when another professional children's theater arranged to do CTC's version of "Babar." David Hulan: You may be right in thinking that something like spiral binding would be appropriate for a collection of introductions/essays. Within the Oz Club, the appeal of such a collection might be mostly to those members who have the older editions and don't really need the full reprints, but who would like to have just the new material. Bear: I'm puzzled by your comment to me, "Your question about the Oz Research Group is curious." I don't think I asked a question about it? (Perhaps you misread my question about whatever happened to the collection of introductions/essays the Oz Club had had planned?) // More about books in Oz. Nathan DeHoff mentioned the Public Library of Oz and Gureeda's books (these are in Neill's Oz books and RPT's "Speedy," respectively). Bob Pattrick wrote an interesting essay on books in Oz documenting the rather large number that turn up in one volume or another. The essay was included in the collection of his essays that the Oz Club published, "Unexplored Territory in (of?) Oz." I forget if it's currently available. ====================================================================== Date: Mon, 07 Oct 1996 12:49:52 -0400 (EDT) From: "Aaron S. Adelman" Subject: Theosophy and other strange theologies in Oz Empire Greetings! Having been in Philadelphia visiting Barry and with several Jewish holidays in the same month, I haven't had much of a chance to reply to the Digest, so be prepared for what I'm about to say to seem like old business. Concerning the "Mebesian heresies" thread, I really haven't heard anything before on theosophy, but is it anything like Baha'i? I've corresponded some with a Baha'ist over the Net, and they seem to have a religion that is basically the same as the given description of theosophy--recognizing all major religions as deriving from divine revelation, therefore giving legitimacy to all faiths. What I'm really curious about is how theosophy (or any such system) is able to deal with religions that deny the validity in whole or in part of other religions. E.g., my religion, Judaism, is a strict anti-idolatrous monotheism. Accepting Judaism automatically denies the polypostphasic Christianity, the dualistic Zoroastrianism, and the polytheistic or polypostphasic Hinduism. As such, I find it incredible that any ideology could claim validity for both Judaism and any contradictory religion without a) fudging the views of the various religions, or b) lying and hoping that no one notices the problems. =09Popping back out to Mebesian syncreticism, in this case Mebes attempted the solution of ignoring the problem. If he wants to go against Baum, that's his perogative. It's his failure to say why he thinks Baum is wrong that I dislike. =09Popping out to the topic of monotheism in Oz: 1) In _The Life and Adventures of Santa Claus_, reference is made to a Supreme Master who created the universe. (Someone please correct me if I'm wrong.)=20 Presumably this refers to God. 2) In _The Sea Fairies_, Anko claimed that Adam measured him when Cain was a baby. Assuming that Anko is not lying, this implicitly implies that a Western monotheism, such as Judaism, Christianity, or Islam, is THE TRUTH in the Oz universe. If, say, the ancient Greek or Roman religion were THE TRUTH, Adam and Cain, who do not exist in their mythos, would not have been able to meet Anko. Aaron. Aaron Solomon (ben Saul Joseph) Adelman adelman@yu1.yu.edu ====================================================================== Date: Mon, 07 Oct 1996 20:58:46 -0400 (EDT) From: Richard Bauman <72172.2631@CompuServe.COM> Subject: Today's Oz Growls I'm not sure why you want it but here is the Lau post. Date: Fri, 29 Mar 1996 17:30 +0000 (WET) From: lti@lava.net (Linda Inouye) Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 03-29-96 Aloha, This is Katy Lau from Hawaii. I'm 12 and I've read all the Baum Oz books. I met Eric G on the Oz IRC (Chat) last year. I like to draw and maybe you'll see my drawings in the Oz Gazette or Emerald City Mirror someday. :-) "W. R. Wright" (Why are you piglet?) wrote: >Anyone on the Digest know of a source for WOZ theme birthday party supplies?? I had an Oz birthday cake last year. We bought Wizard of Oz plastic figures at Toys R Us (Where does that apostrophe go?) and put them on a birthday cake. The set we got came with Dorothy (and Toto in a basket), Cowardly Lion, Tin Man, Scarecrow, Glinda, and the Wicked Witch. I had green balloon decorations. You could also use green streamers and paper goods. Hallmark sells Wizard of Oz (MGM) stickers that could be used to decorate plastic cups, homemade invitations, or paper goodie bags. There's a whole bunch of cut out and assemble things like a WOZ theater, the Emerald City and nesting Oz dolls at Borders Bookstore. You could use these for a centerpiece, or to play with. One Christmas my mom made a treasure hunt with (paper) yellow brick road clues leading to some Ozzy presents. Here are some other ideas: * Use washable chalk to draw the yellow brick road on a sidewalk or driveway leading to your door. * Pin the tail on the Cowardly Lion, or Pin the heart on the Tin Man * Skip the plates and use "lunch boxes." :-) * Hang green streamers around your door and put a sign that says "Welcome to Emerald City." You could even hang a horseshoe-shaped magnet (the Love Magnet that comes in later books) over your door. * Use yellow playdough and those plastic Oz figures to play "going down the yellow brick road." My little brother who is 5, likes playing with figures in the playdough. * Green ice cream :-} yum! * Play the Oz soundtrack (musical chairs?) Katy Lau You can reach me at lti@lava.net, my mom's account. P.S. I'm going to Las Vegas next month. Any good Ozzy things that I shouldn't miss at the MGM? I'm also going to see the Oz ice show in Las Vegas. Was there a Digest dated October 6th? Maybe that is why I don't get the question. Regards, Bear (:<) ====================================================================== Date: Tue, 08 Oct 1996 15:37:38 -0400 From: JOdel@aol.com Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, Have been lurking for a while and thought I'd stick my head up again for no very particular reason (apart from being stuck at home with a racked-up ankle today). On Oz as myth; Not a very satisfying deffinition from where I am standing. It does not explain any part of how the world, as it is, works. And, Lurline, et. als. notwithstanding, it does not deal with the gods or "powers" which the host culture recognizes (apart from Santa Claus). Nor does it deal with the interaction of human nature, as it is, and as it defines itself in folklore. I'd be more likely to regard it as falling within a hitherto undefined, but persistant, construct, which for convenience I'll refer to as wish-myth, which seems to crop up in a lot of cultures. The host culture typically recognizes that it may be "true" without being "real", since it no allowance is made for it within the local, and already established religious structure. These wish-myths, at least in post-industrial cultures, tend to grow out of art tales which somehow strike a particular resonance within the society. They last for several generations without ever really changing in character, and may or may not fade out afterwards. (Was Fiddlers' Green an actual piece of folklore, was it invented by Chesterton or some such?) They also seem to require a certain extended period to develop. The go-go Gandalf phase of Tolkien fandom, for example, looked like it might produce one, but even an abundance of mass-market tolklones never managed to push it over the barrier and it has returned to its literary roots. While the Star Trek universe will probably keep on chugging away for another 50 years. Quoted and noted; ...>You would have stayed in Oz? Where would you find any books to read?< Try Glinda's Great Library of Knowledge or the Wogglebug College Library. Dave Hardenbrook Interesting. A point I'd not considered. And neither of these sources really strike one as a potential source for *stories* either, do they? But, then, to a kid, I suspect that the promise was that things in Oz would be so interesting that I wouldn't have to stave off the omnipresent boredom with mere reading... And, yes, I recognize the assumption that reading was regarded as a deffinite second best to almost any kind of doing. But that WAS the commonly held public perception of the practice during the period that I was growing up. And probably a more long-lived and enduring one than we'd like to believe. Certainly, at that time the impression that I was given was that while Ma would grudgingly admit that reading was an acceptable waste of my time, she would have prefered that I be doing almost any sort of productive work, or even active play instead. Quite right that if it was wanted, a library would certainly be provided. I also find it interesting. that people keep making provocative comments to Gili. Well provocative to me anyway. Both of these somewhat off the subject of literary Oz, however. "...Don't believe what your friends are telling you. Mac's are NOT becoming obsolete. Apple's hierarchy just has to get it's act together." Dick Randolph Actually, the biggest part of the Mac/Apple problem in current public perception is that the paradigm has shifted and even die-hard Mac purists are being sluggish to respond. The "Mac" is the MacOS, rather than any piece of hardware, and while Apple develops and distributes it, Apple's statistics no longer perfectly reflect the Mac's market -- which is actually growing, slightly. Apple's slightly falling market share recently isn't a reflection of the triumph of Windows as much as it is an indication of the success of it's own clones. (The last two Mac/Windows comparisons I've seen used PowerComputing boxes for their examples. Against Compac, rather than IBM.) Unlike IBM, however, Apple at least provides the OS which their clones run. So they're still at least winning something in that round, if not anything nearly as much as when they provided the hardware as well. ...I haven't seen "Angels in America," but would be interested in knowing about its Oz references, anyway. I remember from reviews of the play that it's about gays, and Judy Garland's Dorothy is something of an icon for gays, who tend to see coming out of the b&w Kansas world into Oz as a metaphor for "coming out of the closet." Ruth Berman And I think I read somewhere that the Stonewall riot erupted during what the police evidently thought was a routine raid on the night of, or maybe the night of the day after Garland's funeral. ====================================================================== Date: Tuesday 08-Oct-96 13:39:54 From: Dave Hardenbrook Subject: Ozzy Things I would like to get an idea, a "head count" as it were :) -- How many here on the Digest plan to buy my book, _Locasta and the Three Adepts of Oz_ when it comes out? -- Dave ====================================================================== ] c/ \ /___\ *** THE OZZY DIGEST, OCTOBER 9, 1996 *** |@ @| | V | \\\ |\_/| | ;;; \-/ \ ;/ >< ] ===================================================================== Date: Tue, 08 Oct 1996 22:16:10 +0000 From: Scott Olsen Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-07-96 Re: Neill's Decline In Illustration Quality I have always thought that Neill's style changed throught the series, but I've never thought his illustrations became especally poor. I'm not an art expert (far from it) but I've always preferred his illustrations for Land and Ozma, then later for Lost Princess/Tin Woodman era. And the early 20's books are interesting in their use of black backgrounds. Neill's style changed so much, so frequently, and so quickly throughout the series, that a case could probably be made that Land, Ozma, and Road were illustrated by 3 different people. Anyone who has been fortunate to view original Neill art for the Oz books knows the illustrations were reduced about 1/3 for publication. (Therefore, I'm not sure if there's that much to the poor eyesight theory.) Regardless, this reduction allowed for some leeway in illustration quality. In other words, a close look at original illustrations sometimes reveals flaws that aren't easily seen in the books. For example, in the original illustration of Benny on page 44 of Giant Horse, it is very apparent Neill forgot to draw Benny's left index finger--then realized his mistake and scribbled it in. This minor error--very obvious in the original drawing--is hardly noticeable in the book. Sincerly, Scott Olsen ====================================================================== Date: Tue, 08 Oct 1996 19:36:24 -0400 (EDT) From: Nathan DeHoff Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-08-96 On Oz as myth: Actually, there are mythological elements in the Oz books, which relate to how the world works. Baum introduces the Rain King and the Rainbow. Neill writes about the Sky Sweepers, who keep the sky clean. There are probably many other examples, if one would care to look for them. Aaron: The existence of a Supreme Master (as Baum mentioned in _Santa Claus_) does not mean that there are no lesser Masters. Indeed, _Santa Claus_ speaks of three such Masters, Ak, Bo, and Kern. Also, the fact that Adam and Cain existed does not necessarily indicate that the Judeo-Christian God exists. Neither of these references successfully indicates that Baum's Oz was monotheistic. Dave: I shall probably purchase a copy of _Locasta and the Three Adepts_, provided I have a sufficient amount of money (usually Buckethead books are not all that expensive, so this will probably not be a problem). --Nathan M. DeHoff "I must ask you to leave everything in the disorder in which you find it." --Professor Wogglebug "Having an Emperor's spirit wished upon you is no joke. It's a blinking bore!" --The Scarecrow ====================================================================== Date: Tue, 08 Oct 1996 19:55:35 -0400 (EDT) From: Richard Bauman <72172.2631@CompuServe.COM> Subject: TODAY'S OZ GROWLS RUTH - Sorry for the misunderstanding. I thought you were asking about the Oz Research Group. When I searched the back issues I found you were the source for information on the current operator. That was why I repeated your post. There's a lot of missing going on lately. Tyler sent me the 6th so now I see why the Lau post was wanted. Dave - I wonder how many sets of 4/5 OCT you received. I'll buy a copy of your new book. Regards, Bear (:<) ====================================================================== Date: Tue, 08 Oct 1996 22:39:54 -0400 (EDT) From: BARRY ESHKOL ADELMAN Subject: Oz somewhere in the subject line Regarding Anko's comments and their relation to monotheism in the Baum universe, Anko makes s many historically dubious comments that I would consider the Adam comment unreliable. Perhaps the books in Oz that do not wither and rot have been pickled. ====================================================================== Date: Tue, 08 Oct 1996 22:41:32 -0400 (EDT) From: Gili Bar-Hillel Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-08-96 "Jodel" :-) I've been told your actual name before, but I don't remember it... so I'll just stick to Jodel! Provocative remarks? To me? Do you mean in general, or just about computers? If computers are what you mean, I have some friends who are very passionate about computers, including one who actually hung up the phone on me mid-conversation when he heard I was buying a relatively primitive Mac... Compared to that, nothing seems provocative :-) (don't worry, we made up almost instantly) As for "The Wizard of Oz" as a myth: I am referring to a usage of the word /myth/ that was very popular among some of my professors at the theatre department - granted this is not how most other people usually use the word /myth/. Many literary texts - especially dramatic texts - build upon existing texts or folklore. Sometimes this takes the form of an obvious adaptation, but sometimes this is done much more subtley, through a hint, a half-quote, a mere suggestion. In order for this to work, the original text must be one that is so familiar to the audience (or the readers) that it is almost a part of their cultural makeup. I would expect that your own cultural makeup is such that if I were to type: "the better to smell you with my dear", you could not help but think of a certain storybook character, whose name I will not mention, the better to prove my point to you my dear. :-) These stories, texts or concepts which are part of a persons cultural makeup are what my professors sometimes refer to as "myths".I would argue that in this sense of the word, "The Wizard of Oz" has acquired mythological status. However, I would also tend to agree that /myth/ is not neccesarily the best word for this, because of its other, more religious connotations, and perhaps a better term should be coined. (If this still seems odd to you, I think the sense of the word /myth/ that I'm referring to is the same sense as is used in phrases such as: "urban myth" or even "mythic proportion", or sometimes when "myth" is contrasted with "fact", meaning something which is not true, but yet is very well known and pervasively believed to be a fact). |\ _,,,---,,_ /,`.-'`' -. ;-;;,_ Gili Bar-Hillel, |,4- ) )-,_..;\ ( `'-' abhillel@fas.harvard.edu '---''(_/--' `-'\_) gili@scso.com (cat by Felix Lee) http://www.scso.com/~gili ====================================================================== Date: Tue, 08 Oct 1996 23:18:25 -0400 (EDT) From: "Aaron S. Adelman" Subject: Buckethead Enterprises of Oz 1) Chris (I assume you're still listening), out of curiousity, why is your publishing organization called Buckethead Enterprises of Oz? 2) Dave, I might buy your book when it comes out. It depends on how much money I have available then, which depends on how many people buy _my_ book... (: Aaron Solomon (ben Saul Joseph) Adelman adelman@yu1.yu.edu ====================================================================== Date: Tue, 08 Oct 1996 21:04:04 -0700 From: ozbot@ix.netcom.com (ozbot) Subject: RE: Ozzy Digest stuff Guess I've been lurking a while myself, but here are a few random (or quasi-random) Ozzy thoughts to throw out-- Ruth was talking about theater productions of various Oz books, and, yes this is a tangent, but I am proud to announce I have finished an ambitious addition to my animation portfolio. I felt it was time to expand my character design work, and I couldn't think of what better theme than Baum's LAND. I have created animated feature-type character designs for the major and some minor characters in the book (and if you ask really nicely, maybe I'll bring them to Swinkies!) Some things to consider-- For the sake of a tighter plot (yes, even LAND could use some tweaking) I had to cut one major character, and for the sake of identifying with the audience (and reviewers of my portfolio) I added one major character not found in LAND. Since it would be more fun to have you guess who these are-- I'm not telling you right away! Any one want to play along? Here's the question one more time-- In terms of creating a more stream-lined and "recognizable" LAND OF OZ animated movie, what one character would have to be cut from Baum's book, and which character would have to be added, without altering the basic plot structure of the book? (Basic plot being Tip's escape and Mombi and Jinjur's revolution before Ozma's ascention.) Oh, and Dave, I'll probably buy your book when it comes out. Of course, I've been meaning to buy David's and Eric's and Melody's too. (Not to mention Baum's and Thompson's!) Guess one way or another you're book's still in a queue of some sort! Danny ====================================================================== Date: Tue, 08 Oct 1996 22:54:32 -0700 From: Ken Cope Subject: Mythologia in Oz The last Ba'hai I spoke to had accreted quite the newage (rhymes with sewage, a line stolen from Penn Gilette) baggage, warning me that massive polar shifts would realign my chakras while Lemuria rose from the sea if I didn't watch out. There is a brand of Religiosity which is way too inclusive and far too credulous for even a fantasist's tastes. Just as I wouldn't cast every follower of Ba'hai in such a derogatory mold, I shouldn't lump Theosophy in the same camp either. "Polypostphasic" eh? Wow. If only I could sling sesquipedalianisms with such impunity. From my meager understanding, the first job of generic religion is to declare all others false. Your posting, Aaron, reduces well to the words of a more famous Semitic scholar, (my favorite marxist) Groucho who was quoted by Woody Allen as saying, "I refuse to join a club that would have me as a member." My exposure to Theosophy has mostly to do with having lived here in California for more than 40 years. California, like Oz, is home to more than one Utopian vision. Los Angeles harbored many Vedantists (followers of the Vedas, non-native Hinduists,) Annie Besant (A theosophist mentioned in Wicked) was involved with an effort to declare Krishnamurti an avatar of the New Age, and he refused to belong to a club... I saw him speak in the Oaks at Ojai before he euphemismed. You'd ask him what is God, and he'd ask you who was asking the question? Joseph Campbell's life was changed meeting Krishnamurti on a transc(endental)ontinental steamer and wrote The Hero With a Thousand Faces. You know, the book Lucas used as the outline for Star Wars when he wasn't quoting Dune, The Foundation Trilogy, Kurosawa's The Hidden Fortress or Ozma of Oz. Myth? Joseph Campbell. Theosophy is part of a teaching that sees Jesus as a rabbi, one who noticed that what he most truly is, is God. In more Eastern cultures the proper response to one who has noticed one's innermost divinity is a bemused "so nu?" A hindu or buddhist greeting translates as "I bow to the aspect of God within you" or some such phrasing. The Theosophist's reconstruction of history to fit their beliefs states that JC was a student of Mystery religions of the far east, became a master and took his traveling show back to the Levant. That routine wasn't wildly popular with the local orthodoxy, and he was forced to fall back on the tried and true "dead and resurrected god" bit; quite popular with the agriculturalists of the Nile, Osiris rides yet again. So Theosophy, which you may by now deduce also dwells on quite the Egyptian motif, incorporates from Judaism elements that fit into its divinatory and alchemical symbolism inventory. Today's Astrology got its Aquarian Age jump start from the Theosophists of the late eighteenth century. The Aquarian Age (as opposed to the passing Piscean) is cast as quite eclectic and electric. Gen and I recently visited the Rosicrucian Museum in San Jose. The Egyptian antiquities collection is quite nifty, and try to imagine a planetarium night sky show with an Egyptian mythological/astrological theme! King Tut's craze happened in the twenties, and the place had more of a Boris Karloff's The Mummy feel. In the teens, Baum was caught up in the romanticism of Egypt enough to visit the land of the Pharoahs and write about it. Baum's Oz contained the Grand Jinjin and the six messengers of light, especially Electra. Picture her by Maxfield Parrish in Edison/Mazda ads, posed in some San Simeon dawn. Theosophy, was one part of the air Baum breathed, Magic was alive in the form of Big Science, Tunguska was the result of a Tesla plasma discharge, (don't confuse me with the facts! print the myth!)and Gregory Maquire's Wizard may have dueled Aleister Crowley. I'm fascinated by the time and culture in which Baum flourished. His belief system is not really public knowledge, and I don't see the need to posthumously impose one upon him and his work. He taught me that the color of your spectacles change the color of the world, and I've learned to value the rainbow. Ken Cope ====================================================================== ] c/ \ /___\ *** THE OZZY DIGEST, OCTOBER 10, 1996 *** |@ @| | V | \\\ |\_/| | ;;; \-/ \ ;/ >< ] ===================================================================== Date: Wed, 09 Oct 1996 09:27:44 -0400 (EDT) From: Nathan DeHoff Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-09-96 Danny: The character that you cut out might have been the Wogglebug. He was not entirely relevant to the plot of _Land_. Indeed, I have a tape of Ray Bolger reading _Land_, in which the educated insect does not appear. Strangely enough, when Baum attempted to make a stage play of _Land_, the Wogglebug was the title role. Also, the bug is one of my favorite characters (but then, I have a LOT of favorite characters). Was the character that you added the Cowardly Lion? I seem to remember hearing of another play of _Land_, in which the Lion was added to the cast of characters. Ozma and Oz, Forever! --Nathan M. DeHoff ====================================================================== Date: Wed, 09 Oct 1996 11:28:45 -0400 (EDT) From: Gili Bar-Hillel Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-09-96 Ken Cope - WHAT?! I'm going to need some time to unravel all of that. Or was that part of your point? Anyway, as far as the bottom line, I love Oz too :-). As for Judaism and Theosophy, Aaron, if this interests you, I know that at a certain point Gershom Scholem was into theosphy, from the philosophical if not the religious aspect. Gershom Scholem did a lot of research about some of the kookier aspects of Judaism: kabbalah, messianic movements like the Shabtai Zvi phenomenon, etc.: I'll admit that's about all I know about Scholem's work, but I did see his name mentioned quite a few times when I was trying to research Baum's connection to Theosophy (couldn't make head or tails of the book I had). All I know about the Ba'Hai is that their temple and gardens in Haifa are one of the most beautiful sites in Israel. |\ _,,,---,,_ /,`.-'`' -. ;-;;,_ Gili Bar-Hillel, |,4- ) )-,_..;\ ( `'-' abhillel@fas.harvard.edu '---''(_/--' `-'\_) gili@scso.com (cat by Felix Lee) http://www.scso.com/~gili ====================================================================== Date: Wed, 09 Oct 1996 12:33:40 -0400 (EDT) From: "Mark K. DeJohn" <103330.323@CompuServe.COM> Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-09-96 From: Barbara DeJohn Hi Digest !!! In response to Danny's question of who could be eliminated and who should be added to LAND I think that the Wogglebug could be eliminated without effecting the story although I like his character and bad puns. The Cowardly Lion is my bet for adding a character. Dave, I will buy your book and I look forward to your other endeavors as well. I also will buy the Adelman book . So let me know when they will be published. Barbara DeJohn 103330.323@compuserve.com ====================================================================== Date: Wed, 09 Oct 1996 12:45:19 -0700 From: "Stephen J. Teller" Subject: OZ matters I was going to reply to Aaron's comments on Theosophy, religion and Ba'hai, but Ken Cope's comments were so thorough that nothing more is needed. The Lizbeth Zwergner illustrated edition of WIZARD has been mentioned on the digest. Does anyone who has a copy wish to do a review of it? If so, contact me at steller@pittstate.edu. Steve T. ====================================================================== Date: Wed, 09 Oct 1996 12:43:31 -0600 (CST) From: Ruth Berman Subject: Ozzy Digest A bit more information on the French Co. Oz plays -- the first two, "Wizard" by Elizabeth Fuller Chapman and "Land" by Elizabeth Fuller Goodspeed (I imagine these are the same person divorced and remarried in the same year), came out in 1928. That isn't as old as I thought (copyright runs another seven years). The other two, "Ozma" and "Yew," byMary Buchanan, came out in 1935 and 1937. Compared to the Witmark script, the French "Wizard" has the disadvantage of not having the songs -- but the advantage of not having the silly interpolated scenes about the skeleton butler Tibia. Scott Olsen: I don't think the size reduction is enough to assist a bi-focaling artist. It's still difficult to detail-work, or so I suspect from Baynes' comments on no longer being able to the kind of detail-work she did for her Narnia illustrations. And the decrease in fine detail-work in Neill's late illustrations suggests a similar problem. Danny: In terms of "recognizability," I would guess that you added Cowardly Lion to your "Land" animating. In terms of cutting, I'd guess that the Gump could be eliminated. The characters could squeeze onto the Sawhorse (or hitch up a wagon -- or have some ride the Lion) for transportation. Close? I don't think anyone answered the question Bill Wright forwarded from Elizabeth Blackadar, so I'll comment here (and will send separately to her) that the tv-movies about Baum she mentions are probably "Dreamer of Oz" (with John Ritter as Baum) and "The Making of the Wizard of Oz" with Angela Lansbury as narrator. Both have been put on the market as commercial videotapes, and a video-store could probably find them in its catalogues and arrange to get them in. Tyler Jones: Like you, I much enjoyed Phyllis Ann Karr's "The Gardener's Boy of Oz." When the book opens, there is no bridge between Jinxland and the rest of Oz (she assumes that with Jinxland's immediate problems solved at the end of "Scarecrow," it was again forgotten and left on its own). At the end, they've decided that easier communication would be a good idea and have started building a bridge. Ruth Berman ====================================================================== Date: Wed, 09 Oct 1996 18:04:09 -0400 From: "Melody G. Keller" <104270.2374@compuserve.com> Subject: Ozzy Digest, 10-08-96 Dear folks: There has been discussion on how vision problems affect artists. Presbyopia (which arrived right on schedule when I turned forty) could have affected my ability to draw if I had had normal vision. But I was lucky--I've been nearsighted since grade school. That was what scared me away from radial keratotomy--it might have ruined my clear near vision without helping my far vision very much. As it is, I do have clear vision about 10 inches away from my eyes when I remove my glasses---which is how close I like to be to a drawing-in-progress. Now that I've experienced bifocals, there is something about reading through a lens that makes one feel like one is not fully SEEING what one is reading. Perhaps this is caused by the "tunnel vision" of seeing type through a smaller part of the lens than before. Another part of getting older is being bugged by goopier eye secretions--blink, blink, blink--blinkety--. Also an extra annoyance when trying to do detailed work. And ANYTHING that can cause shakiness (no, hopefully I'm a long way from Parkinson's yet) can get in the way of good artistry, too. Melody Grandy ====================================================================== Date: Wed, 09 Oct 1996 15:58:03 +0000 From: Jeff Feathergill Subject: Wizard of Oz/Gay Identity Issues In. Hi Dave, I am looking for an article on The Wizard of Oz that was published in the 1980's. It is by a Jungian Psychologist and discusses how gay male identity development is mirrored in Dorothy's experience in The Wizard of Oz. Hope you're not offended. Please email me if you have any info. ====================================================================== Date: Wed, 09 Oct 1996 21:24:40 -0400 From: Ozisus@aol.com Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-09-96 Anyone: Got some questions you'd like me to pose to Maguire, author of Wicked, when he speaks in Topeka later his month? I'd love to hear them and pass them along. The article about the discovery of baby Dorothy Gage's grave was on the Associated Press wire and also showed up in Topeka, KS. Does anyone know if Sally Wagner gets e-mail? I'd love to hear more about her search and discovery. There are about thirty different stage productions tied to Oz included in the Oz chronology that I posted in the IWOC web site that you could find doing a word search on "play." You might have to do some research to track down info based on news report in the place/date where they first appeared, but it might be worth it to see, say, The Wizard of Oz in the Wild Wild West, once again. I'd love to know what Buffalo Bill was doing in it. Anybody out there near Philadelphia who'll be doing the Oz-theme flower show? The Club newsletter could use a first-hand report. And anymore word on the Harold Arlen exhibit in New York, like dates or a contact-for-info name? Jane ====================================================================== Date: Wed, 09 Oct 1996 22:14:14 -0400 From: Ozisus@aol.com Subject: Oz: Baum poem In case any of you haven't seen this Baum poem, read away. Could be a useful addition to FAQs about the parable on populism theory. It has been published in a letter to the editor of the New York Times (from Michael Patrick Hearn) and David Parker reprinted it in his excellent essay about the populism theory. I don't know if it has a title. When McKinley gets the chair, boys, There'll be a jollification Throughout our happy nation! And contentment everywhere! Great will be our satisfaction When the "honest money" faction Seats McKinley in the chair! No more the ample crops of grain That in our granaries have lain Will seek a purchaser in vain Or be at meercy of the "bull" or "bear"; Our merchants won't be trembling At the silverites' dissembling When McKinley gets the chair! When McKinley gets the chair, boys, The magic word "protection" Will banish all dejection And free the workingman from every care; We will gain the world's respect When it knows our coin's "correct" And McKinley's in the chair! L. Frank Baum Chicago Times Herald, July 12, 1896 ====================================================================== Date: Wed, 09 Oct 1996 22:24:14 -0400 From: "Melody G. Keller" <104270.2374@compuserve.com> Subject: Ozzy Digest, 10-09-96 Ken: Robin Olderman said you used to be a computer animator at Disney. A while ago, I saw your name go by on the Beauty & the Beast credits! Melody Grandy ====================================================================== Date: Wed, 09 Oct 1996 23:25:22 -0400 From: HermBieber@aol.com Subject: For Ozzy Digest Re: Oz Prices I recently was in Turkey several weeks, so am woefully behind in reading the digests. Therefore this comment may be old hat. Barbara asked about the price of Handy Mandy vs Hungry Tiger. Hungry Tiger IS one of the more commoner Thompson titles; it was published near the height of her popularity. And, as has been mentioned, the Oz series was pooping out around Handy Mandy time. So most knowing dealers will note this relative scarcity and price accordingly. (However ignorant dealers will always price Handy Mandy less than a color plate Hungry Tiger because they "know" that all Oz first editions had color plates). On a more morbid note, it is obvious to me that the later Oz titles are mostly in the homes of the original purchasers, who are still alive. After they die, these books will be "recycled", and I would expect the latter titles to become much more common in the future. Note also the extreme scarcity of the first edition of the last title in the FF, Merry Go Round. Herm Bieber ====================================================================== Date: Thursday 10-Oct-96 10:01:09 From: Dave Hardenbrook Subject: Ozzy Things _LOCASTA AND THE THREE ADEPTS OF OZ_: So far, 5 people of good sense have stated that they will buy my book. :) Any others? It will be a book of about FF length with an exciting plot, lots of Ozzy humor, high-quality illustrations (also by me); and once again, this is the book that does for the Good Witch of the North what _Disenchanted Princess_ did for Tip. :) QUESTION FOR MAGUIRE: Ozma has asked me to submit this question, as on account of _Wicked_ the Ozian Chamber of Commerce already reports a 20% drop in tourism and 1,500 Oz citizens have moved to Canada. So the question from *Ozma herself* to Gregory Maguire is: "Are you a genuine fan of the Oz books beyond _Wizard_, and if so, why do you write such a disfigured, nightmarish vision of our beautiful land?" As stated by Ozma, the question I concede may be a little harsh, so why not make it just "Are you a genuine fan of the Oz books, and if so why did you decide to write such a 'different' depiction of Oz?" -- Dave ====================================================================== ] c/ \ /___\ *** THE OZZY DIGEST, OCTOBER 11, 1996 *** |@ @| | V | \\\ |\_/| | ;;; \-/ \ ;/ >< ] ===================================================================== Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 12:11:54 -0400 From: Tyler Jones <104707.656@compuserve.com> Subject: Ozzy Digest For some reason, I have been on my "old" account the last two days, so here are responses to the 8th and 9th digest. BTW, my old account was supposed to be destroyed September 30. Apparantly, they forgot. I wonder if this means I can effectively have TWO megs of memory for my web page? I better not, in case they catch up on their accounting. Nathan: It is quite likely that Ozma took the effort to locate Kiki Aru's homeland, if only to insure that there would be no more magicians. Therefore, there is a good chance that some form of communication has been established, although the Hyup country may be as inaccessible as ever. One solution to this would be to create a stairwell similar to the one in Flathead Mountain. Aaron: The most likely route of Universalism is to "fudge" the areas where belief in one philosophy/relgion mandates disbelieving in others. While not completely true to the originals, it is the easiest thing to do. For many reasons, I beleive that no one relgion/etc. is THE TRUTH in the Oz Universe. Rather, elements from all earthly beliefs manifest themselves here. You can notice the same effect in AD&D volume _Manual of the Planes_. Hopefully, Katy's suggestions will go in to one of the FAQ's. Dave: Count me in for one of each book you write! :-) Aaron: Same as above, for books you write! :-) Danny: My guesses: You have added Dorothy and have taken away the Gump. I would have guessed you took away Jinjur, but as you mentioned, that would have changed the basic plot. --Tyler Jones ====================================================================== Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 13:21:43 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Olderman Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-09-96 Scott: Neill's illos were frequently reduced considerably more than by 1/3 or even by 2/3. The _Emerald City_ paintings and the full-pagers from _Tik Tok_ are reduced by at least 75%. His chapter headings for _Tik Tok_ and for _Wonder City_ seem to have suffered an even more severe reduction. FWIW, I think he was trying to mimic Denslow when he did _Land_ and _Ozma_. Dunno what the heck he was doing in _D. & Wiz._, since his style varies throughout the book--esp. in the cps. Some are lyrical and romantic and soft (appropriately so, when he deals with cloud fairies and Ozma and Dorothy and roses), while others are harsh and, well, bizarre. I'm not fond of the book, nor do I consider it to be a good Neill book, but I do enjoy the rock faces he hides, etc. I'd like to know what was going on in his life that makes the book so different looking from all of his others. Ken: *I'm* impressed! ;-) Gili: Gee, I hope I've never been "provocative" in my remarks to you.... --Robin ====================================================================== Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 15:07:00 -0400 (EDT) From: Mark Anthony Donajkowski Subject: oz book mark from congress well oz has hit the government my freind in detriot sent this ill include all the info i can and try to get this scanned its like a book mark it has the emerald city in the background and the tin man dorthey and lion at a cross road the singpost says yellow brick road crossed by hte information super highway its cute cause the munchkins are using computers nad handing dorthy a keyboard it says illustrator mike McMillen representitive jill kahn there is a number below jills name if its a phone or a web site or telnet site i dont know its 612.925.1699 if its a phone number i dont think its a michigan one unless we have a new area code hugs anthonyv an pyre ====================================================================== Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 17:07:13 -0400 (EDT) From: BARRY ESHKOL ADELMAN Subject: Telltale Alien Devil Babies of Oz Jane, I am in Philadelphia. I was not aware of an Oz-themed flower show. (I need to pay more attention to what's going on in town.) When and where is it and how much? (We poor interns are paid squat...) Dave, I'll add your book to the list of ones for me to purchase. It's a long list, though, including other Oz books, George Sand, Stanislaw Lem, and the _Zohar_. Fortunately (for you, not me) the local labor dispute with Borders Books has not been resolved, which makes it difficult to purchase (a lot of) books (I really, really want) there with a clear conscience, including a lot of Oz books, so at the proper time if I ration myself the price of a book, I jut might purchase directly from the publisher... My guesses: cut--Wogglebug, added--Dorothy. ====================================================================== Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 17:57:56 -0400 (EDT) From: Richard Bauman <72172.2631@CompuServe.COM> Subject: TODAY'S OZ GROWLS Jane in Topeka - I hadn't read "Wicked" when Maguire was here signing. If I had...... What bothers me about his book is as follows. The people on this Digest who write "Oz" books and Oz authors in general do it with respect for Baum and RPT, etc. and the existing body of work and the spirit which it embodies. Some of them go to great efforts to make things fit chronologically, characterologically, geographically, etc. Maguire has taken a modest knowledge of Oz, a more modest knowledge of psychology, a basic swords and sorcery plot and a gloomy vision of life and created "Wicked." In a way I see this as symptomatic of the 90's. It seems much easier to sell evil, violence and destruction than "kinder, gentler" visions. (Ask David, Eric, Melody, Dave, etc.) Admittedly, the book is "well written." However, for me that does little to make up for its moral and "sense of life" flaws. I wonder what Maguire will attack next; maybe Alice In Wonderland or Wind In The Willows or maybe Winnie The Pooh. No one has twisted, distorted, and begrimed any of them yet, to my knowledge. Now that I think about it, Maguire makes a case for having a longer period until literature comes into public domain. So what would I ask him? Something along the line of "Do you feel any responsibility for what you have done in perverting someone else's work?" Jane again - Could you elaborate on "the discovery of baby Dorothy Gage's grave." I didn't see anything about this. I just reached Dave's kind and gentle question for Maguire. I'll stick with my mean and rough question. Growlingly, Bear (:<) ====================================================================== Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 18:09:51 -0400 From: DavidXOE@aol.com Subject: Ozzy Digest, 10-05 thru 10-09-96 I'm back, but I'm also busy, so I'll just hit the high spots of what's been said while I've been gone. Nathan: It's true that in GRAMPA it says that the army of Ragbad "had deserted and marched off to Jinxland", but it never says they got there. Could be they just heard stories about Jinxland third-hand or more after Trot and Cap'n Bill's adventures there, and thought it would be a good place to look for military work. All the other Ragbadians would know was where they were going when they left; since there was nothing for the army in Ragbad (except possibly punishment for desertion), they presumably would have gone elsewhere to find work. OTOH, maybe a bridge -was- built over the bottomless chasm. Not a job I'd want, but maybe with magic it would be feasible. Scott: _De gustibus non disputandum est_ and all that sort of thing. How anyone could prefer ROAD or DOTWIZ to WISHING HORSE or SPEEDY is beyond me, but to each his own. If I had to name my 14 favorite Oz books (from the FF) it would probably include half a dozen each from Baum and Thompson plus MAGICAL MIMICS and MERRY-GO-ROUND. Nathan (and Tyler): Actually, we only have two cases I know of in the FF where a character falls into a named ocean and ends up in the Nonestic - Dorothy into the Pacific in OZMA, and Peter into the Atlantic in PIRATES. We don't know where Betsy was in TIK-TOK when she fell in the ocean, and Peter in GNOME KING and Bucky in LUCKY BUCKY both flew through the air a long way before landing in the Nonestic, though both started out from the eastern US. Trot and Cap'n Bill went into a whirlpool in the Pacific, but were clearly rescued by mermaids, who can cover vast distances in a twinkling; again, not much evidence. And if Oz is really somewhere in the South Pacific, it makes Peter's feat of swimming from somewhere off Cape Hatteras to Octagon Island a really spectacular one. Why wasn't he in the Olympics in 1936? Aaron: I know almost nothing about Theosophy directly (I've read descriptions of it by a couple of skeptics, but quoting those probably isn't fair). I have read some Baha'i literature, at least, although it was over 40 years ago and I don't remember it all that well. But my recollection is that they consider all or most other religions valid in the same sense that Christianity and Islam consider Judaism valid - i.e., that they have a portion of The Truth that was as good as anyone had until the Final Prophet (for the Baha'is, Baha'ullah, as Jesus for the Christians and Mohammed for the Muslims) came along and gave out the Real Hot Skinny. I suspect that the same thing was true of Theosophy, only it was Mme. Blavatsky who was the Final Prophet. Of course, when you've already had the Real Hot Skinny for over 3000 years, it all seems a bit unnecessary... :-) Incidentally, I echo (someone)'s query - is "polypostphasic" a technical term in theology, or is it one you invented? (I assume it means something like "claiming to be monotheistic but it takes a lot of imagination to believe that and everything else in the religion as well".) Joyce: Sorry you've got a racked-up ankle. Personal E-mail will probably precede this to you. I know I was discouraged from reading as much as I wanted to, too, when I was growing up. Of course, I probably really -did- spend overmuch time reading, since it was what I'd rather do than anything else. (Gureeda was a kindred spirit of mine, yes indeed.) I don't know what my mother's reaction would have been if I'd just wanted to read, say, 2-3 hours a day. There was something in a mystery I just read (WHO DROPPED PETER PAN, by Jane Dentinger, to be specific) about Dorothy/Judy Garland being an icon to gay males, to the point where "Friends of Dorothy" is something of an ingroup nickname they sometimes use. Dave: I plan to buy LOCASTA when it comes out. If I live so long... (Not that I don't anticipate another 20-25 years, but from what I've heard of the schedule, will that be long enough?) Scott: Neill's style changed frequently through the FF (or the 35 of them he illustrated), but especially in the last few his style became much less detailed and scratchier than it was in the earlier books. Check the illustration of Ozma on page 281 of LUCKY BUCKY - a really nice pose and one that I remember fondly, but not one I'd use to show someone what Ozma looks like. (My favorite one of her is probably the one on page 83 of WISHING HORSE, if you want to check it out.) Nathan: Baum's most mythopoeic books are outside the Oz series; THE LIFE AND ADVENTURES OF SANTA CLAUS and THE SEA FAIRIES are the two books where he goes into the most detail about how the universe works. (They're also two of his poorer books, IMHO; mythmaking wasn't his forte.) Of the Oz books, TIK-TOK is probably the most mythopoeic, and it's not one of his better books, either, though I imagine the fact that it's a rehash of OZMA has more to do with that than the mythmaking. Gili: FYI, "Jodel" is Joyce Odell. And I think what she meant about "provocative remarks" to you were that people were saying things to you that provoked comments from her, though maybe she'll answer that herself. Aaron: If you're going to publishers like Tor, then your income is unlikely to be much influenced by how many people buy your book, at least short term. If they buy it, you'll get an advance, and it'll have to sell a large number of copies before you get any additional royalties, at least based on the reports of friends of mine who've had quite a few books published by Tor. Their first book went into something like a fifth printing before they saw any additional royalties. What good sales will mean, however, is that your second book will be much more likely to be published. Danny: My guess is that you cut Professor Woggle-bug (the only important thing he does is swallow a wishing pill), and added the Cowardly Lion (who was the only major Oz character from WIZARD who didn't appear in LAND). Am I right? (I haven't seen anyone else's answers as I write, though they'll probably appear a day before this post does.) And now I should be able to keep up until I leave town next Saturday (the 18th) for a bit over a week... David Hulan ====================================================================== Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 20:04:01 -0400 From: DavidXOE@aol.com Subject: Ozzy Digest, 10-10-96 Nathan: Looks like you and just about everyone else picked the same two major characters that I did for Danny's question, except that Ruth deleted the Gump instead of the Woggle-bug. I think the good Professor is easier to delete, though I like the character. (Else why would I be writing a book where he's the title character, after all?) Melody: I'm not an artist, but I too have avoided radial keratotomy because it does nothing for presbyopia - it just changes the distance that you don't have to wear glasses for. With my habits, I'd rather be able to read without glasses and wear glasses for distance work than vice versa. Jane: One question for Maguire - did he refer to "Kumbric witches" instead of "Krumbic witches" because GLINDA was still under copyright when WICKED was published, or because he forgot how Baum had spelled it? (Dave already asked my other main question for him.) A case could be made that Baum really didn't admire McKinley all that much; his poetry usually scans much better than that one did. :-) Dave: Hey, I'd be happy to help make up that tourism deficit, or even replace one of the Oz citizens who left for Canada! Can you put in a word for me to Ozma? :-) David Hulan ====================================================================== Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 20:38:11 -0400 (EDT) From: Mark Anthony Donajkowski Subject: (fwd) The Wizard of Oz (fwd) found this under alt cult movies thought you all might be intrested in it Very strange little version of the film with Oliver Hardy and Larry Semon is on sale from the AIKMAN ARCHIVE on tape at only $19.98. Their number is (508) 428-7198 ====================================================================== Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 20:37:16 -0400 (EDT) From: Gili Bar-Hillel Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-10-96 Yes, yes Dave, of course I'll buy your book. But WHERE IS IT? Ruth - I gathered from Elizabeth Blackadar that someone had replied to her privately be e-mail, and was able to offer her copies of both movies. I myself wrote her to volunteer as a potential penpal. Jane - my mother just e-mailed me that the item about Dorothy Gage's grave appeared in at least two Israeli newspapers, too: Ha'aretz (which is like the Israeli "New York Times", that's where my review of Thomas Tedrow's book was published, too), and "The Jerusalem Post" (which is the largest English language newspaper in Israel, and therefor has a wide circulation in the United States as well despite its political bias). |\ _,,,---,,_ /,`.-'`' -. ;-;;,_ Gili Bar-Hillel, |,4- ) )-,_..;\ ( `'-' abhillel@fas.harvard.edu '---''(_/--' `-'\_) gili@scso.com (cat by Felix Lee) http://www.scso.com/~gili ====================================================================== Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 20:42:16 -0400 From: Tyler Jones <104707.656@compuserve.com> Subject: Ozzy Digest The Buckethead page on my website has been updated. Several books are no longer available, but two new ones are, with some more forthcoming. The package deals are no longer in effect, since most of those have sold out. --Tyler ====================================================================== Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 20:43:37 -0400 From: DIXNAM@aol.com Subject: Ozzy Digest 10-10-96 Dave: I most certainly will buy your book! I am anxiously looking forward to it, as I am the Adelman brothers book. Ruth Berman: I replied to Elizabeth Blackadar-Stull privately, and have sent her copies of "The Dreamer of Oz" and "The Whimsical World of Oz" (an old PBS program). I did advise her that "Dreamer" was far from an accurate portrayal of the life of LFB. And like many of you, I sent Happy Birthday wishes to 6 year old Allie, whose Mom was looking for Ozzy party ideas. Dick Randolph ====================================================================== Date: Friday 11-Oct-96 13:54:12 From: Dave Hardenbrook Subject: Ozzy Things QUESTION FOR MAGUIRE: On reflection, I prefer Bear's more direct question to my "diplomatic" version, and Ozma agrees. Ozma: The day Bear confronts Maguire, I wanna be there! SOUTH WINKIE CONVENTION: Only a week and a day to go till the convention!!! :) :) :) Is there anyone on the Digest I can look forward to seeing there? IN REGARD TO KIKI ARU: What I can't figure out is, how could Ozma trace Kiki Aru back Hyup Country when upon his disenchantment he immediately lost his memory? MORE ABOUT _LOCASTA_: Some people have asked me about the price of my book. It has not been determined (because I'm still finishing the illustrations), but as soon as they are and Chris has a price, you'll hear it on this Digest first! :) -- Dave ====================================================================== ] c/ \ /___\ *** THE OZZY DIGEST, OCTOBER 12, 1996 *** |@ @| | V | \\\ |\_/| | ;;; \-/ \ ;/ >< ] ===================================================================== Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 17:47:34 -0400 From: Homer Dave- What is the price of the book, and is it hardcover or paperback? Shortly and sweetly, Tony ====================================================================== Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 22:06:52 -0700 From: ozbot@ix.netcom.com (ozbot) Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest stuff Wow, you guys are good, or maybe my questions were too easy. Yes, the Cowardly Lion was added as a character in my "what if LAND was an animated movie" idea, and, sorry HM TE fans, but the Wogglebug would have to be dropped. Nothing personal, you understand, just interested in plot (and not having to draw *too* many characters!) While I agree that the Gump might be a potential "dropout" candidate, his creation and character are just too good to pass up. Actually, the way this movie would play out in my head (I can actually think and draw at the same time-- go fig) even "major characters" like Jack and Sawhorse might give way to the famous Trio. Not only would having so many characters clutter up the screen and not leave much room for too much development, but the Trio (Scarecrow, Woodman, Lion) work so well with each other (Brains/Mental, Heart/Emotional, Courage/Physical) that they almost work as one. (Hmm, "3 in one" wait-- too much theological themes already!) As much as I love Pumpkinhead and see the value in the Sawhorse, they are really just plot devices. the Former gets Tip away from Mombi and introduces the Powder of Life and Mombi's powers, the Latter merely gets people from A to B. Of course, they both add great humor (and would work absolutely great as computer animated effects) but even so, I imagine they would be left behind in the great escape from Jinjur's Emerald City as the Trio and Tip "gump" their way to Glinda. Can you see the emotional value as hostages? "Don't leave us father! I'm too young for pie!" :) Whew, I talked more than I thought I would. If anyone's still interested in this topic, I could share some other ideas I came up with, mostly theory behind character design, but also in terms of story and character development, too. (Maybe I'll start to build up a storyboard portfolio around Oz, too) Danny BTW Dave, great question for Maguire! (I loved the Ozma bit) ====================================================================== Date: Fri, 11 Oct 1996 06:34:33 -0800 (PST) From: earlabbe@juno.com (Earl C. Abbe) Subject: Ozzy Digest Submission In the 10/10 Digest Jane says, I intend to visit the Oz Festival at Longwood Gardens, in mid-November, barring work or other difficulties. Younger son now attends school in Philadelphia, so there will be no problem convincing my wife to go. And she loves Longwood, anyway. So I will probably be good for a few comments at least. Dave asks if any of us will buy his book. But of course. I will be out of touch in New Hampshire for the next ten days. When I return the e-mail stack will be daunting. So it will be a while before I comment again. ====================================================================== Date: Fri, 11 Oct 1996 09:06:56 -0700 (PDT) From: Eric Gjovaag Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-04-96 Dave, remember my request the other day for a copy of the October 4 > From: Tyler Jones <104707.656@compuserve.com> > Subject: Ozzy DIgest > > David and Nathan: > Another possible explanation is that different passes were used in the > books. WHile it is mentioned somewhere that there is only one pass in and > out of Oogaboo, this information was probably given by the Oogaboos > themselves. They rarely if ever leave their country and few visit, so it is > possible that there are many passes through the mountains and people may > actually use two of them while believing they used the same one! Golly, Tyler, despite the fact that Baum himself states that there's only one pass into and out of Oogaboo (and not, AFAIR, any of the Oogaboos who say this), and it was David and I who wrote about the pass in later books, and the fact that there is no conflict in the published versions of our books, and that if Karyl and I ever get around to writing our sequel to "Queen Ann in Oz" it will address this very issue anyway, you may be right. > From: DavidXOE@aol.com > Subject: Ozzy Digest, 10-03-96 > > I suppose > it's theoretically possible Peter was just a Cub Scout, if they had Cubs as > far back as 1930; I don't know about that. Coincidentally, I believe the Cub Scouts were indeed founded in 1930. > From: Tyler Jones <104707.656@compuserve.com>, again > Subject: Ozzy Digest > > David and Eric: > Ozma mentioning that the forest *will* be moved is sufficient to make me > believe that it will be (or was, from our time's perspective). I use a > similar example from _Land_ when discussing Mombi's magical strength. > > Near the end of _Land_, Glinda says that after Mombi restores Ozma, she will > force Mombi to drink a poition which will eliminate Mombi's magical power. > While we do not actually witness the drinking, it is unlikely that Glinda > forgot to do this and I assume that after that story, Mombi no longer has > any magical power. But Glinda and Ozma are different characters. No doubt Glinda didn't forget, but Ozma at the time of "Queen Ann" may have had other things on her mind, or there may have been unexpected difficulties, or...well, if Karyl and I ever write our sequel, read that for full details, okay? > From: Richard Bauman <72172.2631@CompuServe.COM> > Subject: TODAY'S OZ GROWLS > > David - You would have stayed in Oz? Where would you find any books to read? > Particularly mysteries! I don't recall ever seeing any in Oz. What good would > it be to live forever if there is nothing new to read? Ah, I see another book > for you - "The Authors of Oz." :) (Eric turns on his tape player and his voice comes from the speaker, saying): Read "Unexplored Territory in Oz." Pattrick has an entire essay on books and other reading material in Oz, with a bibliography. And I'm sure Ozma would be glad to magic up a few mysteries for you anyway. (Eric presses stop) > From: Tyler Jones <104707.656@compuserve.com> > Subject: Ozzy Digest > > Nathan: > I agree that Lulea and the fairy queen in _Santa Claus_ are the same, but > I believe that Lurline is different. Despite both being from Burzee, they > seem to have different responsiblities and powers. As do the Knooks. They are the keepers of animals in "Santa Claus," but of the trees in "The Road to Oz." Hey, centuries may have passed, perhaps the heirarchy and responsibilities of the immortals subtly changed over the decades. And Lulea decided to change her name (or start using one of her other names, no reason she can't have more than one), perhaps. --Eric Gjovaag ====================================================================== Date: Fri, 11 Oct 1996 09:28:31 -0700 (PDT) From: Eric Gjovaag Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-08-96 > From: Dave Hardenbrook > Subject: Ozzy Things > > I would like to get an idea, a "head count" as it were :) -- > How many here on the Digest plan to buy my book, > _Locasta and the Three Adepts of Oz_ when it comes out? C'mon, Dave, is it really appropriate for you to be asking this? Of course we're going to buy it (well, those of us who buy any book with "Oz" in the title anyway, when we can, and because it's you many others who normally wouldn't buy a non-FF book might just get this one), but why is the "Digest" suddenly becoming so self-serving? Besides, knowing Chris' backlog, it's sort of a moot point right now, we won't be ABLE to buy it for a few years still. --Eric Gjovaag ====================================================================== Date: Fri, 11 Oct 1996 09:34:43 -0700 (PDT) From: Eric Gjovaag Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-10-96 > From: Dave Hardenbrook > Subject: Ozzy Things > > _LOCASTA AND THE THREE ADEPTS OF OZ_: > So far, 5 people of good sense have stated that they will buy > my book. :) Any others? It will be a book of about FF length > with an exciting plot, lots of Ozzy humor, high-quality illustrations > (also by me); and once again, this is the book that does for the > Good Witch of the North what _Disenchanted Princess_ did for Tip. :) Gee, Dave, this is starting to sound like an advertisement to me! And you REALLY don't want to get the e-mail note I send to people who spam me... --Eric Gjovaag ====================================================================== Date: Fri, 11 Oct 1996 14:17:45 -0400 (EDT) From: Tanya L Smith Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-07-96 Dave, I am writing to you to let you know that I am getting rid of my computer and will no longer be on line. Sorry to say that I can no longer receive the Ozzy Digest. You can, for now, take me off your list of readers. If this changes I will be sure and let you know. thanks so much, Tanya ====================================================================== Date: Fri, 11 Oct 1996 21:48:09 -0200 From: amyjones@MindSpring.COM (Amy Jones) Subject: For the Ozzy Digest A trivial Ozzy occurance... While on the way to lunch today, a student of mine decided to be overly active. I took the eighth grade boy by the wrist to guide him to the cafeteria. He immediately began skipping forward, saying "Come on Miss Jones, let's follow the Yellow Brick Road to the cafeteria. You can be Dorothy, and I'll be the Tin Man." He will get an A in my class. :) Amy Jones ====================================================================== Date: Fri, 11 Oct 1996 22:05:12 -0400 From: RMorris306@aol.com Subject: Recent Ozzy Digests Hi again! Once again, to comment on the latest subjects: OZ BOOK PAGES: Please remember that different people have different editions of the Oz books--alas, most of mine are Del Rey paperbacks, which have no illustrations on page 44 of GIANT HORSE or page 83 of WISHING HORSE. So which illustrations of Benny (without an index finger) or Ozma (David H's favorite) do you mean? DANNY'S "LAND" ADAPTATION: I'm inclined to go along with Dorothy as the added character (for reader identification; she's the one Oz heroine everyone knows), but, though the Wogglebug and the Gump are both good guesses, I'll go with the Sawhorse as the character who was dropped. (I assume we're talking major characters here; I'd be surprised if, say, the Soldier with the Green Whiskers or the Queen of the Field Mice *was* in the adaptation.) Even the Wogglebug wouldn't be hard to costume for a human actor, whereas the Sawhorse would be a lot harder. (Not quite as hard as the Gump, but hard enough, and the Gump's role isn't quite as important for as much of the book.) GILI AND COMICS: Glad you liked my digression about Hayfoot Henry. Comics are definitely a specialty, and I've been working for some years on writing a book about Superman...so, understandably, I've researched the titles in which he appeared (including ACTION COMICS) extensively, and talked to (I believe) all his living editors and most of his living writers and artists. A lot of fascinating information there...did you know that, according to one story, THE WIZARD OF OZ was inspired by a time-travel adventure involving Supergirl? KIKI ARU: Well, aside from a purely metaphysical argument (that, since *Baum* know who Kiki was and where he came from, there must have been some Oz informant who told him) there's no real evidence that Ozma and her friends ever found out. But, judging from the fact that he's never seen around the Emerald City again (unlike his erstwhile partner Ruggedo, and the other children who get to live there) I'd guess that she did find out, probably by looking in Glinda's Book of Records. (Or perhaps, as again happened more than once with Ruggedo, the effects of the Water of Oblivion eventually wore off.) MAGUIRE'S "WICKED" I doubt very much that "Kumbric" was a deliberate misspelling; more likely it was just an accident of the type even official Oz historians have made more than once. (Thompson especially had a way of misspelling names and sticking to them--"Bettsy Bobbin," "Gilliken Country," "Kalico"--which showed that her editors were also sleeping on the proverbial job!) Rich M. ====================================================================== Date: Fri, 11 Oct 1996 22:20:25 -0400 (EDT) From: Richard Bauman <72172.2631@CompuServe.COM> Subject: Today's Oz Growls David - Peter is such a strong swimmer in Gnome King that he can swim with Ruggedo on his back, keeping the surly gnome almost completely out of the water. See the illustration. Of course the text says Peter towed him by his beard. More friction between artist and author? Favorite Ozma's - p. 175 of Ozma of Oz (real regal quality IMHO). Regards, Bear (:<) ====================================================================== Date: Fri, 11 Oct 1996 19:30:24 -0700 From: ozbot@ix.netcom.com (ozbot) Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest stuff Wow, you guys are good, or maybe my questions were too easy. Yes, the Cowardly Lion was added as a character in my "what if LAND was an animated movie" idea, and, sorry HM TE fans, but the Wogglebug would have to be dropped. Nothing personal, you understand, just interested in plot (and not having to draw *too* many characters!) While I agree that the Gump might be a potential "dropout" candidate, his creation and character are just too good to pass up. Actually, the way this movie would play out in my head (I can actually think and draw at the same time-- go fig) even "major characters" like Jack and Sawhorse might give way to the famous Trio. Not only would having so many characters clutter up the screen and not leave much room for too much development, but the Trio (Scarecrow, Woodman, Lion) work so well with each other (Brains/Mental, Heart/Emotional, Courage/Physical) that they almost work as one. (Hmm, "3 in one" wait-- too much theological themes already!) As much as I love Pumpkinhead and see the value in the Sawhorse, they are really just plot devices. the Former gets Tip away from Mombi and introduces the Powder of Life and Mombi's powers, the Latter merely gets people from A to B. Of course, they both add great humor (and would work absolutely great as computer animated effects) but even so, I imagine they would be left behind in the great escape from Jinjur's Emerald City as the Trio and Tip "gump" their way to Glinda. Can you see the emotional value as hostages? "Don't leave us father! I'm too young for pie!" :) Whew, I talked more than I thought I would. If anyone's still interested in this topic, I could share some other ideas I came up with, mostly theory behind character design, but also in terms of story and character development, too. (Maybe I'll start to build up a storyboard portfolio around Oz, too) Danny Dave, great question for Maguire! (I loved the Ozma bit) ====================================================================== Date: Sat, 12 Oct 1996 03:16:54 +0000 From: Scott Olsen Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-11-96 Re: Robin's comments about Neill's illustrations & Dot/Wiz Of course you're right about the reduction in Neill's art size. I had forgotten about some larger one's I've seen... I agree about the illustrations for Dorothy & Wizard. It has the most frightening illustrations of any other Oz book (esp. the color plates). However, when I was younger, for some strange reason, it was my favorite book. Re: David's comment about liking LFB's 14 Oz books, etc: <> I suppose it'd be a pretty boring place if everyone agreed on the same thing. You're right. I guess it is "to each his own.." ;) <> Merry-Go-Round is an excellent book, to be sure. But I agree with many that it lacks a certain Ozzyness... <> That is a good one, but I must agree with Dave that the one in the front of Tin Woodman is the best one that comes to mind... Re: David's question about SOUTH WINKIE CONVENTION: <> If my work doesn't force me to work overtime, I'll be there. Re: My previous post on the digest I proofed the post after it was sent. Thank you all for no comments about my spellling. Sincerely, Scott Olsen ====================================================================== Date: Sat, 12 Oct 1996 01:41:00 -0400 From: Tyler Jones <104707.656@compuserve.com> Subject: Oz Anthony: FYI, 612 is the area code for Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota. Fairly close to Michigan. This must be a state thing, since there is no Jill Kahn in COngress, but there is a PHYLLIS Kahn in the Minnesota House of Representatives. Therefore, that 612 thing could be a phone number, since it can't be an internet domain. Internet domains contain four numbers, none of which can be greater than 255. Also, Michigan has received no new area codes with the new upgrades and even if it did, 612 would not have been one of them, since 612 is an "old-style" area code. David: _The Ragbadian Army of Oz_ could be an interesting story. Even granting the bridge mentioned in _Gardeners Boy_ is accepted, the army may still have wandered, since there would be nothing for them to do in Jinxland either. David and Scott: Scott's preference for the Baum books may be based on the same reason most people prefer the original _Star Trek_ to later series. There is an indefinable appeal to "the original", which started it all, that sometimes transcends other qualities, since Kirk and/or Baum was where it all began. FTR, I prefer _Next Generation_ and RPT. "Friends of Dorothy" was a phrase used in _Clueless_ to describe the new student, when Cher mentioned that he was very desireable. Apparantly, he was out of her reach. If I understand correctly, _Tik-Tok_ was a rehash of a rehash, being based on a play which in turn was based on _Ozma_. Anthony: I've heard of that movie. It was in 1925 and L. Frank Baum Jr. was involved in it somehow. Dave: Sadly, I cannot go to the South Winkie Con. My new job starts Tuesday, and I need to prepare for it. There is, however, always next year. I suppose Glinda's book of records could have recorded Kiki Aru's origin, or perhaps she could have used the same procedure in _Glinda_ to determine it. Could the Magic Picture respond to "Show me Kiki's home" If Kiki himself did not know where it was? One possibility is that the water of oblivion only supresses memory, so the picture would be able to "dig" the info out of Kiki's head. --Tyler Jones ====================================================================== ] c/ \ /___\ *** THE OZZY DIGEST, OCTOBER 14, 1996 *** |@ @| | V | \\\ |\_/| | ;;; \-/ \ ;/ >< ] (NOTE: There was no Digest for October 13. -- Dave) ===================================================================== Date: Sat, 12 Oct 1996 11:04:45 -0600 From: tallison@mcs.com (Tim Allison) Subject: Baltimore Please, doesn't anyone know any Ozfans who live in Baltimore? As I mentioned some months ago, I have the phone numbers of a couple of potential members who live in that area. Since the Club does not, as far as I know, send out information to anyone who isn't joining, I'd like to have someone call them, and right now long distance phone calls are not a possibility. Thanks Carol Mitchell ====================================================================== Date: Sat, 12 Oct 1996 10:17:42 -0500 (EST) From: better living through chemistry Subject: RE: Ozzy Digest, 10-11-96 Overheard at the public library video section this week: "Oh yeah.... Oz is way cool!" a 10 or 11 year old to her mother. Scott ====================================================================== Date: Sat, 12 Oct 1996 10:19:58 -0400 From: DavidXOE@aol.com Subject: Ozzy Digest, 10-11-96 Tyler: Ozma presumably knows of the existence of the Hyup country; she sent a bird there to proclaim her prohibition of magic-working. But she may not have known that Kiki Aru was from that country; apparently he dressed the same way other Munchkins do. From that it would appear that there's a fair amount of communication (presumably via birds) between the Hyups and the other Munchkins, even if they never see each other. (How the Hyups got to the top of Mt. Munch in the first place is a question that some OZIANA author might like to answer. Gili, maybe?) I don't think Danny could have added Dorothy to LAND without changing the basic plot line. Bringing in someone from outside Oz would have to be considered a major change, in my opinion. Of the major characters in WIZARD, Dorothy and the Wizard are outsiders, and all the others except the Cowardly Lion are already used in LAND. (Even most of the minor characters are used in LAND; about the only exceptions are the GWN and Boq, unless you count groups like the Dainty China Country, the Fighting Trees, and the Hammerheads.) That's why I'm pretty confident that the Lion is Danny's added character. And I think the Woggle-bug is an easier character to drop than the Gump, though either is a possibility. Bear: I don't recall seeing a twisted version of the Alice books or Winnie-the-Pooh, but I have read one of THE WIND IN THE WILLOWS - it's called THE WILD WOOD, by Jan Needle, and you'd probably dislike it too, though not as much as you disliked WICKED. It tells the story from the point of view of one of the weasels; from that POV the main characters are a bunch of idle gentry who maintain their indolent lifestyle by the oppression of the laboring class (the weasels and stoats), and the takeover of Toad Hall is the first stage of a proletarian revolution. I found it interesting and enjoyable for what it was, but I imagine it's too left-wing for your taste. (Unlike WICKED, it's written and marketed as a children's book, though a British children's book - which these days means written at an intellectual level considerably higher than the equivalent American children's book.) I think one of the reasons no one has "twisted, distorted, and begrimed" the other children's books you mention is that none of them really creates a usable secondary universe; the Alice books are dream-landscapes with no sense of reality to play on, and Winnie-the-Pooh and THE WIND IN THE WILLOWS are set in a slightly-fantasized English countryside. Oz, on the other hand, seems real and has a large amount of background to draw on for perversion as well as extension of the original series. There aren't many other secondary universes like that, and most of them, if they've become at all popular, have drawn parodists - e.g., BORED OF THE RINGS. Dave: Ozma could presumably find out Kiki Aru's origins by going to the Magic Picture and saying, "Show me this boy's parents." (And then, "Show me their house", and "Show me their village", and "Show me everything in a ten-mile radius of their village.") Actually, she must have done something like that if we accept the "informant" theory of the Oz books; how else would the informant have known about Bini and Mopsi Aru, or Kiki's name? (I think we have to assume that Baum just made up the scenes between Kiki and Rug based on his knowledge of their characters, since there's no way an informant could have told him about those incidents. Reporters do that all the time these days, and occasionally get sued for it...) David Hulan ====================================================================== Date: Sat, 12 Oct 1996 11:55:43 -0400 (EDT) From: Mark Anthony Donajkowski Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-12-96 > ====================================================================== > Date: Sat, 12 Oct 1996 01:41:00 -0400 > From: Tyler Jones <104707.656@compuserve.com> > Subject: Oz > > Anthony: > FYI, 612 is the area code for Minneapolis/St. Paul, Minnesota. Fairly close > to Michigan. This must be a state thing, since there is no Jill Kahn in > COngress, but there is a PHYLLIS Kahn in the Minnesota House of > Representatives. Therefore, that 612 thing could be a phone number, since > it can't be an internet domain. Internet domains contain four numbers, > none of which can be greater than 255. Also, Michigan has received no new > area codes with the new upgrades and even if it did, 612 would not have been > one of them, since 612 is an "old-style" area code. ill check with friend who i hope to hear from soon and see where he got this at if anyone is intrested ill try to get more of them from him hugs anthony van pyre > Anthony: > I've heard of that movie. It was in 1925 and L. Frank Baum Jr. was > involved in it somehow. yes its talk about in the oz scrap book i posted it here so folks could get it ive seen some of it on bbs when i was a child ozma was very pretty hugs anthony van pyre ====================================================================== Date: Sat, 12 Oct 1996 12:23:14 -0400 From: DIXNAM@aol.com Subject: Ozzy Digest 10-12-96 Bear: Indeed, Neill's illustration of Ozma on p.175 of "Ozma of Oz" is very regal. My favorite, in that book, is the one facing the title page. The one mentioned in "Tin Woodman" is another favorite of mine . . . mainly because it resembles pictures of my mother when she was in her late teens. (:-) Dick Randolph ====================================================================== Date: Sat, 12 Oct 1996 12:53:48 -0400 From: HermBieber@aol.com Subject: For Ozzy Digest Re: Navy Alphabet Am still two weeks behind in Degest reading but wanted to comment on Scott's Navy Alphabet find. I only see one or two of these per year, and very good copies are going for $1200 and up these days. This means a tight copy with good insides: sound hinges, no page tears or scribbles. The cover should be bright with minimal scuffing, and corners more or less there. Corners tend to be rounded or broken off, as in the Wogglebug, another fragile beast. The paper spine should also be more or less there. These books had weak covers, and I have never seen "fine" covers, only fine insides. For a truly mint book with fine covers the price would probably be in five figures at auction. If the insides have problems, the price drops rapidly. I'd say the one you describe might fetch $400 to $500. I think the Navy is a little scarcer than the Army, and it used to sell for 20% more. But lately the prices have been comparable. My research indicates that they correlate with last year's Army-Navy football score. Cheers, Herm Bieber ====================================================================== Date: Sat, 12 Oct 1996 19:08:38 -0400 (EDT) From: Richard Bauman <72172.2631@CompuServe.COM> Subject: Today's Oz Growls Golly Eric, if you ever get around to writing another Oz book, I for one would not mind you touting it a bit here as it is an Oz book. Now if you were to write a book on postwhatchamacalitism, that would be spamming....IMHO..... Tanya - is "getting rid of my computer" - fascinating! I wish she had kept it long enough to tell us why. How on earth can a person live these days without a computer? Scott - Don't give spelling a thought. It's out of vogue. We have Digesters who can't spell, captitalize or punctuate! Weekend regards, Bear (:<) ====================================================================== Date: Sat, 12 Oct 1996 20:18:38 -0400 From: Tyler Jones <104707.656@compuserve.com> Subject: Oz Danny: The HBO series may have influenced my guess of Dorothy being added, since she was added to the _LAnd_ sequences, and thus journeyed a while with Tip. Eric Shanower also was "encouraged" to add Dorothy to his stories, instead of Trot, since more people know who Dorothy is. Eric: Regarding the pass(es) in and out of Oogaboo, I was just theorizing. I am sure the next book you write with Karyl will put the issue to rest. However, this exchange has demonstrated an interesting point in Ozzy lore. Baum himself directly said that there was only one pass in and out of Oogaboo, and this does not produce a conflict between _Queen Ann_ and _Glass Cat_. However, working from our "informant theory", either someone told Baum of this "fact", or else he simply guessed. I still maintain that none of this absolutely guarantees that there ISN'T another pass, although it is unlikely, and it is not necessary to have one. I'm just saying that the possibility still exists. Same goes for the forest being moved or not. I'll wait for your story. Oz book pages: One solution is to give a chapter reference. While not as accurate as a page number, it will be a Universal reference that everybody can use. Peter B. Clarke used this method in his excellent _Who's Who, What's What, and Where's Where in Oz_. This does not count as an advertisement, since the book sadly is out of print. Dave's comments about his Oz books do not strike me as advertising. One of the goals of this digest is to expand people's awareness of Oz, both in and out of the Digest and IWOC. Buying copies of Oz books is one way to do this. ***** SHAMELESS PLUG ***** As Chris Dulabone of BEOO says, Oz books make great Christmas Presents! :-) --Tyler Jones ====================================================================== Date: Sat, 12 Oct 1996 21:45:25 -0400 From: DavidXOE@aol.com Subject: Ozzy Digest, 10-12-96 A couple of things before I start commenting on others' posts: I got the Spring BAUM BUGLE today (spring will be a little late this year, as Mr. Loesser once wrote...). Good issue. And there's an Ozzy drop-caps font that they're using that I CRAVE! I don't know how many others there are out in cyberland who'd pay good money for it, but if it belongs to the Club, I'd suggest offering it as a means of raising funds. (Or maybe as an possible premium for Sustaining Members, or some such.) I'm going to E-mail Bill Stillman directly, but I thought I'd draw it to the attention of the others on the Digest who might also be interested in inquiring. The "O" has a picture of Ozma, the "I" I-wish-I-was (from Un, in COWARDLY LION), the "T" the Tin Woodman and Tik-Tok, and the "W" the Wizard and the Woggle-bug. I assume the creator of the font has found other characters to incorporate into each capital letter. And I want it! Now! Also, I picked up a copy of the latest Donald Abbott Oz book from ECP the other day, HOW THE WIZARD SAVED OZ. It's not bad, though not great. Much better than SPECKLED ROSE, and better than MAGIC CHEST or FATHER GOOSE; I'd put it about on a par with HOW THE WIZARD CAME TO OZ. *******************Spoiler alert******************************** It appears to take place fairly late in the Wizard's reign. The Queen of the Field Mice appeals to him when all her subjects have disappeared. It turns out that Mombi and the evil Sir Riskit, who was a cousin of the vanished King Pastoria, have captured them to run a machine that will draw all the magic out of Oz. But the Wizard and the Queen succeed in foiling them. It explains a number of obscure points in the canon, though possibly not consistently with other attempts to explain the same points. Still, it's reasonably FF-consistent, as far as I noticed. *****************End alert************************************** One problem it has is that it seems to have been poorfread. That is, it was spellchecked, but nobody seems to have read the final galleys before it was sent to the printer. "To" for "too" is easy enough to miss, but I find it hard to believe that a human reader would miss "insight" for "incite" or "except" for "accept" if anyone had actually read the final version. Oh, well. It's worth buying in PB, though I don't think in HC. Danny: I agree with you - leaving Jack and the Sawhorse behind when the rest of the captives take off in the Gump would both reduce the number of characters you needed to draw (and the whole incident with the jackdaws' nest, while a good source of tension in the book, is quite unnecessary to the plot, and getting rid of it would eliminate the need for the silly bit about counting to seventeen by twos - which is mathematically wrong and bothered me even as a kid) and give a few added fillips to the plot without any difficulty. So when do we get to see this movie? :-) Rich: I didn't realize that the Del Rey editions of the Oz books had the illustrations on different pages from the original hardcovers. OK, the illustration of Ozma that I like best is the first one of her in Chapter 5 of WISHING HORSE; she's holding her wand or scepter rather delicately by its upper end in her left hand, is bending over slightly, and the right and lower areas of the picture are filled with flowers growing on vines. Ozma is absolutely gorgeous, and not at all childlike. Chris D. to the contrary notwithstanding, I don't think of Ozma as a little girl. I don't think Kiki Aru's absence from future Oz books is any indication that he was returned to his family. Unlike Ruggedo, he probably had his memory wiped out permanently by the water of the Forbidden Fountain, in which case he would continue to live in the EC as a nameless Munchkin boy. We know there are over 50,000 people in the EC, and we don't know the names of more than 50 or so of them; it's not surprising that a character in Kiki's situation would never turn up again. As for "Kumbric", we'll see, if Jane gets a chance to ask Maguire my question. (I think she should ask it before she asks Bear's, if we're to get an answer...) Bear: Peter is clearly a strong swimmer, but from Cape Hatteras to the South Pacific? (Presumably around the Cape of Good Hope through the Indian Ocean; it's too hard not to sight land going around Cape Horn, as well as being farther, I think.) Your choice of Ozma pictures is a good one - actually, I rather like the one on the facing page; she looks sort of come-hitherish in it - but I still prefer the one in WH. Scott: For the record, it was Dave, not David, who asked about South Winkies. :-) (It's only that with the two of us among the more active people posting here, it's convenient to give each of us our preferred version of our common forename.) (And I wish I could be at South Winkies, too, but it's a bit far and anyhow I'm going to be at a different convention - in Zinzinnati - that same weekend.) Tyler: I don't believe there was any L. Frank Baum, Jr. The "Frank" among LFB's sons was Frank Joslyn Baum. David Hulan ====================================================================== Date: Sat, 12 Oct 1996 20:58:09 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Olderman Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-12-96 The 1925 version of the WoO was distributed by Chadwick Pictures. L.F.B.,Jr. is credited as coauthoring it with Larry Semon (who played the Scarecrow) and some guy named Leon Lee. It is, indeed, a strange little film. Not at all "Ozzy," but quite interesting in its own right. Semon is a fine scarecrow. Oliver Hardy looks ridiculous both as a farmhand and as the Tin Woodman, but what the heck! South Winkie Goers: Please hug Langley for me. Really! Give her a hug and tell her it's from me. I miss the Winkies, I do, I do. ====================================================================== Date: Sun, 13 Oct 1996 02:58:45 -0400 (EDT) From: Mark Anthony Donajkowski Subject: oz stuff thought folks might be intrested in this i found it at cnn's web site Oz by a Kansas tornado may have been born in the heartbreaking death of an infant in Illinois. Five-month-old Dorothy Gage died in 1898 as her uncle was writing "The Wonderful Wizard of Oz." The tragedy inspired L. Frank Baum to name his heroine Dorothy Gale and make her the ideal girl his family imagined the real Dorothy could have become, historian Sally Roesch Wagner believes. "If someone dies in your family, the immediate use of that name is done in a very careful and respectful way," Wagner said last week. "It becomes a name with a lot of import, a lot of emotional meaning." Wagner has known about the real Dorothy for years, ever since the girl's sister mentioned her during a discussion of family history. But it was only during a recent trip to Illinois that Wagner was able to find Dorothy's timeworn tombstone in the north-central Illinois city of Bloomington. Records at Evergreen Cemetery led Wagner to a tiny gray stone, its letters reduced to illegible grooves. The director of the McLean County Historical Society, Greg Koos, suggested an old genealogy trick: spread shaving cream on the stone and then wipe away the excess to reveal the letters. "I brought the squeegee down and there was `Dorothy.' It took on life then," Wagner said. "She really was buried in Bloomington. There really was a Dorothy." Dorothy was the niece of Baum's wife, Maud Gage Baum. When the sickly child died, Maud Gage Baum traveled from Chicago to Bloomington for the funeral. She had always wanted a daughter of her own, and the funeral upset her so much that she needed medical attention, Wagner said. Baum dedicated "The Wonderful Wizard of Oz" to his wife when it was published in 1900. Wagner believes the character of Dorothy was a gift to his wife. "He gave Maud her Dorothy in an immortal way," said Wagner, who was in Illinois as a scholar-in-residence at Lincoln's New Salem state historical site and is writing a biography of Mrs. Baum's mother, an activist for women's rights. Baum biographer Michael Patrick Hearn said he is convinced the infant's death led Baum to use the name in his Oz stories. "She was too important to the family," he said. "I think her death certainly gave (Baum) the name, and I think he modeled Dorothy on his nieces." Baum wrote 14 Oz books, and the series continued with other authors after his death. The books inspired several films, most famously the 1939 musical version with Judy Garland. Koos, the McLean County historian, would like to replace Dorothy's weathered tombstone -- perhaps with a stone adorned by a pair of silver slippers like the ones Dorothy wore in Baum's version of the story. "I think people will want to see the site," Koos said. Copyright 1996 Associated Press.Allrightsreserved.Thismaterial may not be published, broadcast, rewritten, or redistributed. =A9 1996 Cable News Network, Inc. All Rights Reserved. CNN - Oz journey may have begun with baby's death - Sept. 30, 1996 (p5 of 5) story. hugs anthony van pyre ====================================================================== Date: Sun, 13 Oct 1996 15:54:21 -0400 From: "Melody G. Keller" <104270.2374@compuserve.com> Subject: Ozzy Digest, 10-11-96 Bear: > I wonder what Maguire will attack next; maybe Alice In Wonderland or Wind In The Willows or maybe Winnie The Pooh. . No one has twisted, distorted, and begrimed any of them yet, to my knowledge. Yes, they have, to a degree--there was a porno version of 'Alice' done back in the late '60's or early '70's. Also, somebody once sold prints featuring a clothingless, grownup, dumb-blonde Alice wandering through Wonderland. However, even Carroll's Wonderland is not exactly Paradise, as Oz claims to be. To me as a child, Wonderland was a nightmareland full of lunatics. At least most of the grownups in the Wizard of Oz were comfortingly sane! "Winnie-the-Pooh" has been smirched somewhat, though not by literary vandals like Farmer and Maguire--a famous rock star who had bought the house of the original Christopher Robin died there--either of drowning or drug overdose or both. And the original Christopher Robin, in later years, supposedly came to hate the characters he helped create. Rather similar to Ozma Mandell's problems with her first name... Don't know if anyone's tried to trash "Wind in the Willows," yet. It's a famous children's classic, but not as famous as "Wizard." That's likely what has protected it, so far. The Bible does speak of those who "hate what is good." There seem to be a lot of those around, lately. Melody Grandy ====================================================================== Date: Sun, 13 Oct 1996 20:53:18 +0000 From: Scott Olsen Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-12-96 Re: Del Ray Edition & Picture Of Benny The illustration of Benny is the one used as a chapter heading for Chapter 3. However, I doubt that you would be able to see the part of the illustration in question in a Del Ray edition. But it's worth a try. Scott Olsen ====================================================================== Date: Sun, 13 Oct 1996 19:00:16 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Olderman Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-12-96 Neill Illustrations: I think I know the illustrations Scott means. The ones from WONDER CITY are considerably smaller than the ones I've seen from his earlier work. This leads me to wonder if he downsized as he grew older because he knew he was using less detail than when he was younger. As I look at two of his later originals, I'm not convinced that failing eyesight was the cause of the change in style. The details are there, beautifully delineated, when he wants them to be. I'm guessing, of course, but I believe the shift in style was more a voluntary choice than a necessary one. Herm, maybe the next time you talk to Hearn you could ask him? ====================================================================== Date: Sun, 13 Oct 1996 21:44:15 -0400 (EDT) From: "Aaron S. Adelman" Subject: Polypostphasism and other really long words in Oz Empire 1) Ken, "polypostphasic" refers to the divine equivalent of multiple personality disorder--one deity acting as more than one. As I understand it, Christianity and at least some versions of Hinduism fit this description. Also: Actually I wouldn't consider it the main thrust of any religion I know of (in my understanding) to declare all others false. But it is a logical consequence of different religions holding different views that not all can be logically reconciled. Also: Who is this Krishnamurti character? Also: The term "rabbi" does not mean one who notices that he/she is God. (Indeed, deification of mortals is a cardinal crime in Judaism.) The term is Hebrew and Aramaic for "my master", and it used to be used when speaking to anyone in a position of authority, later coming to be used as a form of address for ordained teachers. Also: I have trouble seeing what sort of "elements that fit into its [Theosophy's] divinatory and alchemical symbolism inventory" are present in Judaism, as my religion's views on magic and astrology are ambivalent at best, as many magical acts, such as divination and necromancy, are outright prohibited, leaving most of the discussion of whether any of it works or not to theory. Anything of a really magical nature would have to come from qabbAlAh, the ever-controversial Jewish mysticism (ever-controversial since there are those who question its origins and/or consider it heresy). Considering that Jesus and the Egyptian mythos don't mix well with Judaism, the whole shebang sounds suspisciously more of an all-reconciling religion in name than in reality. Also: _Crowley_ was involved in all this? The man who considered himself to be the Antichrist? The man who wrote "Do what you will shall be the whole of the law"? (Sidenote: Crowley is the man whose work I have purposely avoided in researching magic for _Lurline's Machine_. Anyone who considers himself to be evil incarnate, my instincts scream, "Stay away from him!") 2) Dave, my informants tell me that Maguire's informant was Bastinda's quasi-illegitimate son Liir, who paid Maguire huge amounts of money (not so much money in Oz, as gold is cheap there) to clear his mother's name. Of note is the libel suit that the Wizard recently brought against Maguire and the curse Lurline placed on his shoe laces... (: Aaron Solomon (ben Saul Joseph) Adelman adelman@yu1.yu.edu ====================================================================== ] c/ \ /___\ *** THE OZZY DIGEST, OCTOBER 15, 1996 *** |@ @| | V | \\\ |\_/| | ;;; \-/ \ ;/ >< ] ===================================================================== Date: Mon, 14 Oct 1996 10:35:44 -0400 From: DIXNAM@aol.com Subject: Ozzy Digest 10-14-96 David: I too received my Spring edition of the Bugle on Saturday, and YES, I too would like to get my hands on that font! Your idea of offering it as a premium for Sustaining memberships is fine with me, but so is cash, check or charge card. (I think the only letter you omitted to mention was the "S", with the Scarecrow and Scraps.) Let me know Bill's reply . I won't e-mail him with the same question. Thanks. I was impressed with the edition. Better late than never! Dick Randolph ====================================================================== Date: Mon, 14 Oct 1996 10:55:50 -0400 From: DavidXOE@aol.com Subject: Ozzy Digest, 10-14-96 Carol: Michael Turniansky seems to be the only contributor to the Digest who lives in the Baltimore area, and he's not an IWOC member himself. (There may be lurkers who live there as well, of course.) Dick: I rechecked the picture of Ozma in TIN WOODMAN that so many people like; I don't really like it that much, myself. Reminds me of Mary Pickford as Rebecca of Sunnybrook Farm, or something of the sort. But tastes differ, obviously... Bear: I too wish Tanya had explained why she was getting rid of her computer. I suppose that if one had to move into markedly less spacious quarters there might be a problem having room for it, but that's about the only reason I can see for backing off. (It's not as if used computers have a significant market value, compared to their utility value.) Tyler: The only problem with chapter references for illustrations is that there are often multiple illustrations of a particular character in a given chapter. However, this can be compensated for by giving the order of the illustration in the chapter - always, of course, assuming that the illustrations weren't moved to different chapters, or put in a different order, in a non-facsimile version of the originals. (Or just left out, like the one strongly racist illustration of a Tottenhot in the BoW PATCHWORK GIRL.) Anthony: Thanks for the reprint of the AP article on Dorothy Gage. (And particular thanks for leaving in the capitals and punctuation. ) Melody: I hadn't heard about the porno "Alice", but I'm not greatly surprised. I do recall that Farmer used Alice Liddell - the real person, not the character from the book - as a principal character in TO YOUR SCATTERED BODIES GO, but that's not quite the same thing. (Richard Burton - the 19th century explorer/author, not the 20th century actor - was the POV character, and an adult Alice Liddell was his love interest.) David Hulan ====================================================================== Date: Mon, 14 Oct 1996 10:06:56 -0700 From: ozbot@ix.netcom.com (ozbot) Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest stuff Oops-- Sorry about the "post-echo" the other day. Don't know quite what happened there. Oz spotting and never stopping-- A recent Toys R Us ad highlighted Wizard of Oz action figures. six figures (Dorothy, S'crow, Woodman, Lion, Glinda, Witch, Wizard, some with accessories like Toto in a basket for Dorothy) all obviously MGM related and probably tying into the MGM video release. I'm not sure on the size of the figures, but for the price of 9.99, seems like a good deal. BTW, it's advertized as a Toys R Us exclusive, so I don't think you'll find them in other stores. LAND the Animated Movie-- Remember, this was just a funny thing for me to do to add to my character design portfolio. Of course, if it lands me (no pun intended) into a position to promote a genuine feature film, you guys will be the first to know! (Hey, in a mathematical dynamic system model, *all* posibilities, no matter how unlikely, must be considered!) Someone mentioned cutting Guardian of the gates and Omby Amby. Actually, I found these characters to work well together as a comedy duo, like Laurel and Hardy or Abbot and Costello. A lot of the humor could be added by their looking out over the gates of the city, and bantering back and forth as they see Tip, Jinjur's army, etc. Don't worry about Dorothy. She'll be back in the next movie, right? :) Crossing his fingers in any case, Danny ====================================================================== Date: Mon, 14 Oct 1996 10:09:17 -0700 From: ozbot@ix.netcom.com (ozbot) Subject: late Ozzy Digest stuff Oops, (again ?) One more thing, count me in for S Winkies. Hmm, "Swinkies," I like the sound of that. (Then again, I don't see anything wrong with Tattypoo. Sorry Dave.) Danny ====================================================================== Date: Mon, 14 Oct 1996 14:13:16 -0600 (CST) From: Ruth Berman Subject: ozzy digest Robin Olderman & Scott Olsen: Yes, the illos in "Dorothy and the Wizard" do seem to be odd, don't they? Aiming at something more grotesque than he usually did, and somewhat unattractive. Perhaps it's in "Road" that he really makes the Oz characters (the Wizard especially?) his own? David Hulan: On the Ragbad army and marching to Jinxland -- assuming that a bridge across the bottomless chasm had not yet been built, would it be possible that "going to Jinxland" was an Ozish idiom for "no forwarding address known"? // You're probably right that "Santa Claus" and "Sea Fairies" are among Baum's weaker stories. I do enjoy the invention of mythologies in them, though, and enjoy them as books for that reason. The mythology in "Tik-Tok," though, strikes me as less interesting. Nice dragon, though. // So the spring "Baum Bugle" is in the mail? that's nice to know. Mine hasn't arrived yet, but I suppose will shortly. The capital letters you describe -- the "Bugle" has been using them for quite a few years, actually. If I'm remembering correctly, they were designed by Bill Eubank. I don't know if they'd be available as a font, although I suppose there would be some way of doing it if there was a demand (and if permissions were available). I bought a couple of the "Oz Kids" videos this weekend, and watched part of the "Santa Claus" one. Would have watched it through, but the weekend was kind of crowded, and I ran out of time. It's clunky in some ways, what with having to identify each of a rather large number of characters and having to stop the story dead every now and again to have speeches on Moral Behavior. But it's also quite charming, with an ingenious graft of Baum's "Santa Claus" (and the plot of the Awgwas' attempt to kidnap Santa) onto a story with their own characters, and interesting artwork in the cave scenes, particularly. ====================================================================== Date: Mon, 14 Oct 1996 19:48:56 -0400 (EDT) From: Richard Bauman <72172.2631@CompuServe.COM> Subject: TODAY'S OZ GROWLS DAVID - You told me about Needle's book, THE WILD WOOD, before and I have been trying to find it ever since. Now that I know it is British, I understand my difficulty. We do have a used book store that imports a lot from England, so there is hope. Sure I'll read it and maybe I won't like it, but it won't be the first book I haven't liked. By the by, I bought a copy of BORED OF THE RINGS, but have never read it. Hmmmm - I looked at the Ozma on p. 83 of WISHING HORSE OF OZ. Definitely not a little girl. I would swear I have seen that picture before. Anyone else recognize it? That raises the question, did Neill reuse pictures in later books? Melody - Thanks for the information, I guess. Sigh. Well, I'll bet no one has dumped on "Raggedy Ann and Andy." Hmmm. Maybe even that. Well, how about the Old Mother West Wind series - by Thornton W. Burgess. On second thought, if they have, I don't want to know. :( Sadly, Bear (:<) ====================================================================== Date: Mon, 14 Oct 1996 17:57:22 -0700 (PDT) From: Eric Gjovaag Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-14-96 > From: Richard Bauman <72172.2631@CompuServe.COM> > Subject: Today's Oz Growls > > Golly Eric, if you ever get around to writing another Oz book, I for one would > not mind you touting it a bit here as it is an Oz book. You might change your mind if I were to bring it up every day, and tie everything I talk about in the "Digest" to it... > From: Tyler Jones <104707.656@compuserve.com> > Subject: Oz > > Eric: > Regarding the pass(es) in and out of Oogaboo, I was just theorizing. I am > sure the next book you write with Karyl will put the issue to rest. > > However, this exchange has demonstrated an interesting point in Ozzy lore. > Baum himself directly said that there was only one pass in and out of > Oogaboo, and this does not produce a conflict between _Queen Ann_ and > _Glass Cat_. However, working from our "informant theory", either someone > told Baum of this "fact", or else he simply guessed. Working from YOUR informant theory, It is not necessarily a theory that I or every other reader of this Digest subscribes to, at least not in all instances, for all writers and all that they write. > ***** SHAMELESS PLUG ***** > As Chris Dulabone of BEOO says, Oz books make great Christmas Presents! :-) > From: DavidXOE@aol.com > Subject: Ozzy Digest, 10-12-96 > > I got the Spring BAUM BUGLE today (spring will be a little late this year, as > Mr. Loesser once wrote...). Good issue. And there's an Ozzy drop-caps font > that they're using that I CRAVE! I don't know how many others there are out > in cyberland who'd pay good money for it, but if it belongs to the Club, I'd > suggest offering it as a means of raising funds. It was created by the late Bill Eubank, and first appeared on the cover of "Oziana" in 1976 -- yes, the whole thing. The Club has been using it in the "Bugle" for nearly twnty years now. --Eric Gjovaag ====================================================================== Date: Mon, 14 Oct 1996 21:13:09 -0400 From: Ozisus@aol.com Subject: Oz details I privately e-mailed a couple of responses to questions about the Philadelphia flower show. Other interested posters can check the IWOC homepage for more info. The discovery of 5-month-old Dorothy Gage's grave was recently reported by a Gage family expert and biographer, Sally Roesch Wagner. The baby, Maud's niece by her brother and sister in law, Clarkson and Sophie Jewel Gage, died in Aberdeen, S.D. in Nov. of 1898. Her name is believed by credible Baum historians to be why Baum chose to name the heroine of Oz Dorothy. No reports or interviews with Baum ever confirmed that -- at least, none that I've heard of -- he always insisted there was no particular "Dorothy." Nonetheless the timing makes it pretty likely that the baby Maud described as "...a perfectly beautiful baby. I could have taken her for my own and loved her devotedly" lives on in the personality of Dorothy Gale. ====================================================================== Date: Tue, 15 Oct 1996 00:53:24 -0400 From: Tyler Jones <104707.656@compuserve.com> Subject: Oz Several people: It seems that the most likely case to date is that Kiki Aru is living in EC, taking a new name and without memories prior to _Magic_, stories from _Oziana_ notwithstanding. Aaron: In all essence, all relgions cannot be reconciled into a "Grand Unified Theory of Spirituality". The only way to do this in any practical way is to fudge some of the details, much like the HACC. General: In the spirit of politics, I would like to "clarify and expand" my reaction to Scott Olsen's statement that if he listed his 14 favorite Oz books, they would be the Baum 14. The reason I theorized for this was that, in any series that is continued after the creator leaves, there is a lure to the original that transcends any other quality. Therefore, there are those who tend to prefer the original simply because it is the original. While I still hold this to be true, I believe the Baum books have something else going for them. In all the 210 books written over the last century, it is the Baum books that contain the simple childlike innocence of wonder and joy that was never quite matched by anybody else. RPT, with her rock-em- sockem style, Neill with his way-out storylines, and even Jack Snow, who emulated Baum to the extent of copying entire paragraphs from him, never managed to duplicate that spirit of Baum that pervades all his books. Despite the fact that I prefer many other Oz books to Baum's, there is something special about reading one of the Baum 14 and I believe that this is a large part of the reason that many prefer Baum over anybody else. --Tyler Jones ====================================================================== Date: Mon, 14 Oct 1996 22:56:06 -0700 From: Ken Cope Subject: The Polypostwhatchamacalits of Oz In my 'TheOZophy' extemporization, I not only managed to utterly confuse Gili and provoke Aaron into a potentially reasonable public dialogue, I somehow impressed Robin, got Melody to encourage me to talk about time I've spent at Disney (instead?) and pre-empted Stephen Teller from posting his thoughts on the subject. That Tyler was inspired to equate Universalism and the concept of (Capital T)ruth in Oz with something from some G.U.R.P.S. manual or other carries my original point home to its logical absurdity. I can think of neither a better forum for discussing the notion of 'the' religion of Oz, nor imagine a topic more potentially divisive. Fortunately, I have deadlines that preclude me from fanning flames, and would direct those actually curious about these topics to 'The Power of Myth / Joseph Campbell with Bill Moyers' book and PBS series. For me, it all reduces to stories and story telling. You just never can tell how others will use or view your favorite tales. Before you know it, one story has been subsumed by another. And so it goes... --Ken Cope ====================================================================== Date: Monday 14-Oct-96 22:18:21 From: Dave Hardenbrook Subject: Ozzy Things LIST OF PUBLICATIONS FROM BUCKETHEAD ENTERPRISES OF OZ: Chris recently sent me his price list. Here it is: (Anyone who doesn't like this kind of "advertisement" on the Digest, too bad) :) All prices are postage paid. For further details, send a Self-Addressed Stamped Envelope and $1.00 to us at 1606 Arnold Palmer Loop, Belen, NM 87002. order # 8.) *A Viking in Oz* by Chris Dulabone $6.50 13.) *The Deadly Desert Around Oz* Chris Dulabone/Leigh Perry $10.00 14.) *Veggy Man of Oz* Nate Barlow $10.00 16.) *The Magic Diamond of Oz* Danica Libutti, et al $6.00 17.) *The Crocheted Cat in Oz* Hugh Pendexter/CG Taber $10.00 19.) *The Colorful Kitten of Oz* Chris Dulabone/Melody Grandy $10.00 20.) *Wooglet in Oz* Hugh Pendexter/David St. Albans $10.00 22.) *Skeezik and the Mys Tree of Oz* Marcus Mebes $7.00 23.) *A Wonderful Journey in Oz* Ryan Gannaway $5.00 24.) *Dorothy Returns to Oz* Shawn Billman, et al $5.00 27.) *The Dinamonster of Oz* Kenneth Gage Baum/Gita Baum Morena $10.00 30.) *Dagmar in Oz* Chris Dulabone/Charlene Greski $6.00 31.) *The Flying Bus in Oz* Ruth/Corinne Morris $10.00 32.) *Lunarr and Maureen in Oz* Chris Dulabone/Marcus Mebes $8.00 33.) *The Emerald Ring of Oz* Jeremy Steadman/Chris Dulabone $10.00 34.) *Bungle and the Magic Lantern of Oz* Greg Gick/David St. Albans $10.00 35.) *The Magic Tapestry of Oz* Marcus Mebes & Chris Dulabone $8.00 36.) *The Odd Tale of Osoenft in Oz* Marcus Mebes et al $15.00 37.) *The Disenchanted Princess in Oz* Melody Grandy $25.00 38.) *Invisible Inzi of Oz* Baum/Wauchope/Shanower $10.00 39.) *Cory in Oz* Allison McBain $10.00 40.) *The Lunechien Forest of Oz* Chris Dulabone/Mark Woody $10.00 41.) *The Case of The Framed Fairy in Oz* Gil Joel $5.00 42.) *Kaliko in Oz* K. Kline/Michael Goldmann $10.00 43.) *The Marvelous Monkeys of Oz* Chris Dulabone/Paul McGrory $10.00 44.) *Egor's Funhouse Goes to Oz* Chris Dulabone $28.00 45.) *Red Reera the Yookoohoo & the Enchanted Easter Eggs of Oz* RG Quinn/Marcus Mebes (as Anon E. Mouse) $10.00 46.) *Brewster Bunny & the Case of the Outrageous Enchantments of Oz* Marcus Mebes $2.00 with additional order of $15.00 or more, $3.00 a la carte 47.) *The Healing Power of Oz* Gil Joel/Marcus Mebes $12.00. $20.00 for limited color plate edition 48.) *The Lost Emeralds of Oz* Fred Otto/Derek Sullivan $10.00 49.) *The Haunted Castle of Oz* Marcus Mebes $10.00 50.) *The Fantastic Funhouse of Oz* Chris Dulabone $12.00 51.) *Fwiirp in Oz* Nate Barlow, Marcus Mebes, et al $10.00 52.) *The Tin Castle of Oz* Peter Schulenburg $12.00 53.) *Pegasus in Oz* Annie Brzozowski/Steve Burt $10.00 Forthcoming (F) 54.) *A Queer Quest for Oz* Chris Dulabone/Mark Woody $12.00 (F) NON-BUCKETHEAD ITEMS THAT WE'RE ALSO WILLING TO OFFER TO OUR READERS: A2.) *A Murder in Oz* Jack Snow $3.00 A4.) *Oz Activity Book* ABQ Ozmite Club $2.00 A5.) *Sail Away to Oz* Marcus Mebes $5.00 B1.) *Radioactive Teddy Bear from !CENSORED! Destroys Oz* Marcus Mebes & Peter Sandbothe $10.00 OZIAN SEAHORSE PRESS (order from BEoO) OSP1.) *Time Travelling in Oz* Ryan Gannaway/Marcus Mebes $8.00 OSP2.) *Sinister Gases in Oz* Ryan Gannaway/Marcus Mebes $10.00 OSP3.) *As the Clock Strikes Oz* Ryan Gannaway/Derek Sullivan (F) ALSO FORTHCOMING FROM BEoO (in semi-approximate order over the next three million years or so...) AND CURRENTLY CAMERA-READY: *Beach Blanket BabylOz* by Chris Buckley/Melody Grandy *The Magic Ruby of Oz* by Julia Inglis/Michael Patrick Murphy *A Fairy Circle in Oz* by Chris Dulabone/Marcus Mebes *The Shifting Sands of Oz* Mebes/Xiques/etc. *The Joust in Oz* by Annie Brzozowski/Steve Burt *The Three Imps of Oz* by Chris Dulabone/Blair & Kimberly Frodelius *The Giant King of Oz* by Chris Dulabone/George Van Buren *Hurray for Oz!* by Chris Dulabone/Randy Clark *The Roots of Wonder in Oz* by Gil Joel/C. Dulabone *Dark Ages in Oz* by Gil Joel/C. Dulabone *Thorns and Private Files in Oz* by Melody Grandy/C. Dulabone/M. Mebes *Locasta and the Three Adepts of Oz* by Dave Hardenbrook (actually not yet camera-ready, but very nearly) *A Mystical Magical Super Adventure in Oz* Xiques/Dulabone/Grandy (same situation as above) ====================================================================== ] c/ \ /___\ *** THE OZZY DIGEST, OCTOBER 16, 1996 *** |@ @| | V | \\\ |\_/| | ;;; \-/ \ ;/ >< ] ===================================================================== Date: Tue, 15 Oct 1996 17:05:01 -0400 From: Homer I'd very much like to order Buckethead books, and I sent out my $1 and all that to Arnold Palmer Loop. I've never received anything about it yet. Does it usually take a long time? (I feel I have a history of bad luck when it comes to sending for stuff) Oh well. Sincerely yours, even though I never seem to be able to write a decent-sized message, Tony ====================================================================== Date: Tue, 15 Oct 1996 11:08:33 -0400 From: DavidXOE@aol.com Subject: Ozzy Digest, 10-15-96 Ruth: That's an idea - that "going to Jinxland" was Ozian idiom for "left no forwarding address". As people used to say, "gone to Timbuctoo" (and may still say, but it's probably less used now than it once was; I don't remember hearing it recently). I enjoy SANTA CLAUS and SEA FAIRIES for the mythology as well, but they aren't very good stories (except for the Zog section of the latter, but that's less than half the book). I guess that shows how much attention I've paid to the typography of the BUGLE over the years; I just noticed those drop caps with the current issue. (Maybe the lower-gloss paper used this time made them stand out more?) Anyhow, I still would like to acquire the alphabet (whether as a font or clip art) with the right to non-commercial use, if it can be done. I guess it depends on who has the legal rights to it and what kind of licensing agreement can be worked out. Bear: There are definitely Neill illustrations that appear in more than one Oz book; I'm not sure about the one of Ozma in WH that I like so much, but I know I've seen some in more than one place. Whether it was Neill or whoever did layout at R&L that reused them is a separate question. I'd be a little surprised if you'd seen the one from WH elsewhere, since as I understand it you haven't read any of the Thompson books past GNOME KING, and Neill didn't start drawing Ozma in fitted dresses until YELLOW KNIGHT. Unless you saw it when you were just leafing through one of the later books. David Hulan ====================================================================== Date: Tue, 15 Oct 1996 11:38:04 -0400 From: OzBucket@aol.com Subject: How the Wizard Saved Oz Someone wrote a review of this book recently. Even though the review was anything but glowing, it got me interested. I must admit that I had forgotten that the book was out. Does anyone have a copy that he wants to unload cheap? I do not care if it has been damaged, cover torn off, pages ripped out or scribbled in by baby, etc., so long as I can read it. Or maybe someone could loan it to me and I'd send it back? ====================================================================== Date: Tue, 15 Oct 1996 11:51:05 -0400 From: OzBucket@aol.com Subject: Ozzy oops I made a couple of errors on the list. My fault. Both Pegasus ($10.00) and Queer Quest ($12.00) are already available, so the Forthcoming notation (F) should have been deleted. A Silver Elf in Oz (F) will soon be out at $12.00. I hate to admit it, but my average book co$t is not staying at $10.00 as well as I'd like it to... ====================================================================== Date: Tue, 15 Oct 1996 12:13:00 -0400 (EDT) From: Mark Anthony Donajkowski Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-15-96 > Date: Mon, 14 Oct 1996 10:55:50 -0400 > From: DavidXOE@aol.com > Subject: Ozzy Digest, 10-14-96 > Anthony: > Thanks for the reprint of the AP article on Dorothy Gage. (And particular > thanks for leaving in the capitals and punctuation. ) thats only cause i screen captured it and saved it as a txt file and imported it so i didnt have to type it out Subject: TODAY'S OZ GROWLS Beach Blanket BabylOz* by Chris Buckley/Melody Grandy - This is a joke, right? After being further stimulated by David, I was in the book store I mentioned yesterday (Wessex in Menlo Park, CA) looking for a Needle in the book stacks. I ran across a British paperback (Faber & Faber) titled "The Wizard of Oz." The authors are Noel Langley, Florence Ryerson & Edgar Allan Woolf. The blurb on the back says "This is the shooting script, and includes several scenes cut from the released print of the film, such as two big production numbers, as well as a fascinating wealth of detail and colour which contributed to every aspect of the film. This volume also includes an introduction by Michael Patrick Hearn, a leading authority on Frank L. Baum, the creator of Oz." I hope the authority knows it is L. Frank. Anyway, how could I resist. I gather there is a US version of this that I have simply missed in my travels. This is probably of general interest. The Hearn intro is 28 pages. Regards, Bear (:<) ====================================================================== Date: Tue, 15 Oct 1996 20:40:45 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Olderman Subject: OZZY DIGEST I wish you hadn't asked about that picture of Ozma on p.83 of W.HORSE, Bear. Yes, it does look familiar, but that may be 'cause I've read the book so often. Her hair grows shorter in the next illo of her, then longer again by her reappearance at the end. Shades of little Dorothy and MGM! Neill definitely recycled drawings, but I'm not sure he ever used the same drawing in two different books other than those he used both in a regular Oz book as well as in a LITTLE WIZARD story. In PATCHWORK GIRL, he uses bits and pieces of full drawings as fillers, usually as chapter tailpieces, IIRC. The lush 2-pager on pp.184-185 of LUCKY BUCKY clearly was drawn at an earlier time for another piece of work. I seem to remember that the illo of the Scarecrow at the end of Ch.16 in his own book doesn't really belong there. It doesn't match the other depictions of him in the book, and I seem to remember that there once was something under his extended hand. Maybe it's one of the LITTLE WIZARD recycles? I just don't remember, but if you look at it, you'll see that it's different from the others in SCARECROW. I wish I could devote more time to this one; I'm fascinated by things Neillian. (Wow! What an adjective!) --Robin ====================================================================== Date: Wed, 16 Oct 1996 01:01:41 -0400 (EDT) From: "Aaron S. Adelman" Subject: Reviews of sorry Oz books Empire ***ENTER FIRE AND BRIMSTONE MODE--THIS BATCH DESERVES IT!*** Culprit #1: Sail Away to Oz by Marcus Mebes For a dream, this is remarkably sensible. (In my most coherent dream yet, I didn't even retain the same identity the whole way through.) But as poetry, Sail Away to Oz is unremarkable, and as a story evoked from the reviewer "I'm not buying this." The idea of a magical seductress plowing the waters of the Nonestic Ocean and sleeping with every man she meets--and I mean every man, for she not only seduces the protagonist but Rinkitink (!) as well--and binding them with a spell that makes them love her unconditionally is not the most appealing idea--and certainly not the most appropriate one for an Oz book--but we are given absolutely no clue why she does this. If there are references to an Enya song which would explain her motives, I, not having heard much Irish music, am not aware of them. Even more mysterious is the presence of Ozma, which is not explained at all. (Rinkitink is in the middle of the ocean conducting trade.) As such, I was left with a feeling of too many unanswered questions. My rating of this book: one star. (Yes, Tyler, you may quote this one on your web page.) Culprit #2: _The SillyOZbuls of Oz_ by Roger Baum Yet again, we have another villian with no motive, in this case the Evil Wizard who comes to Oz once every thousand years and takes something special to the people. At the time of our story, he chooses to get rid of the SillyOZbuls, which live to bring love and joy into people's lives. How the Evil Wizard is defeated is even less credible. (I can't give EVERYTHING away.) The writing style is eerily Neillian, and the illustrations are reminiscent of Van Gogh. Rating: two stars. Culprit #3: _The Silly OZbul of Oz and Toto_ by Roger Baum Roger apparently didn't know to quit whil he was ahead. While the previous book is weak-villianed, this one is no-villianed, relying on the elements and insects to be the antagonists to Toto and a SillyOZbul on their way to the Wizard's 92nd birthday party after having been left behind by Dorothy and deciding to go anyway. Nothing particularly memorable happens. Rating: one and a half stars. Culprit #4: _The Silly OZbul of Oz and the Magic Merry-Go-Round_ by Roger Baum While the previous book actually had a minimal distributed antagonist, this one's only excuse for an antagonist is that two kids named Tyler and Astrid fear that they may not have time to play with an old, abandoned merry-go-round. This attoconflict is resolved when one of them bothers to check their watch. Other than this, this book is completely plotless, the only thing of any note being that it puts a SillyOZbul in the circus the Wizard worked in before he came to Oz. Rating: one star. (That's being very generous.) ***END FIRE, BRIMSTONE, AND SCREAMING DAEMONS*** Aaron Solomon (ben Saul Joseph) Adelman adelman@yu1.yu.edu ====================================================================== Date: Wed, 16 Oct 1996 01:15:59 -0400 From: Tyler Jones <104707.656@compuserve.com> Subject: Oz David: The only answer for illustration references is for every person in the world to acquire a complete set of first-edition facsmilies. Now, how much would that cost? :-) You are the only person I have ever known who has also read Farmers book _To Your Scattered Bodies Go_, and possibly the rest of the _Riverworld_ saga. This series is not Ozzy by ANY stretch of the imagination, but it was very good nonetheless. Danny: Omby Amby and the Guardian of the Gates rarely converse in the books. The only place I can think of offhand is the quick exchange in _Patchwork Girl_. Given that their jobs are relatively similar, I would have thought they would appear together more often, and I can't wait to see what you do with this idea. Eric: Granted, not everybody subscribes to the informant theory, but neither am I the only one who does. My original point was that nothing written to date absolutely denies the existence of more than one entrance to Oogaboo, although any entrances that may exist are probably well hidden and uknown. The list that Dave posted can also be found at my web site. --Tyler Jones ====================================================================== ] c/ \ /___\ *** THE OZZY DIGEST, OCTOBER 18, 1996 *** |@ @| | V | \\\ |\_/| | ;;; \-/ \ ;/ >< ] ===================================================================== Date: Wed, 16 Oct 1996 12:26:15 -0400 (EDT) From: "Rebecca M. Bichel" Subject: Oz illustrations by Lisbeth Zwerger I just received as a gift from my husband a 1997 calendar titled "Lisbeth Zwerger Wizard of Oz Calendar 1997". The illustrations are very different from those of the Oz illustrators with whom I am familiar. The bio inside the calendar indicates the illustrations are from a recent version of The Wizard of Oz that she illustrated available from North-South Books. I am eager to hear feedback from those who may own or have seen the book or calendar with Zwerger's illustrations. Rebecca Bichel rbichel@liberty.uc.wlu.edu ====================================================================== Date: Wed, 16 Oct 1996 12:48:44 -0400 From: "Melody G. Keller" <104270.2374@compuserve.com> Subject: Ozzy Digest, 10-15-96 Bear & David: I'll bet Tanya got tired of all the money she had to pour into her computer's upkeep. (STOP improving computers!! I can't keep up!!!!!!!!!!) Bear: Don't be put off by Beach Blanket BabylOz's title. It's really a fine, well-done little Oz story! Chris Buckley wrote, I illustrated. Melody Grandy ====================================================================== Date: Wed, 16 Oct 1996 15:16:38 -0400 From: DIXNAM@aol.com Subject: Ozzy Digest 10-16-96 Danny: The WoO boxed figures at Toys R Us include the Fab Four plus Glinda & Wicked Witch. No Wizard. :-( Sometimes book deliveries take two or three weeks. Maybe a private e-mail note to OzBucket? Dick Randolph ====================================================================== Date: Wed, 16 Oct 1996 16:18:57 -0400 (EDT) From: Nathan DeHoff Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-16-96 It sometimes takes a while for stuff to come from Buckethead. Also, I once had an order misplaced (but, after I wrote a note, my order was sent to me). If it takes too long for a reply to come in the mail, you may wish to write a note to Buckethead Enterprises. Bear: If _Beach Blanket BabylOz_ is a joke, it is a long-running one. I seem to remember reading about this one in some relatively old Buckethead books. Tyler: The Soldier with Green Whiskers and the Guardian of the Gates frequently appear together in Neill's Oz books. Snow combines the two into one character. If Baum and the other authors did have informants, perhaps these informants were not characters in the stories, but powerful beings who knew pretty much everything that was happening in Oz. Ozma and Oz Forever, Nathan M. DeHoff ====================================================================== Date: Wed, 16 Oct 1996 16:43:15 -0700 From: "Stephen J. Teller" Subject: OZ Aaron: A word of explanation about SAIL AWAY TO OZ. A friend of Marcus Mebes had become incolved with a femme fatale, un belle dame sans merci, a vampire. Marcus wrote this book to demonstrate the wiles of a certain type of woman. He was taking courses in Classics at the time and so used the methods of Homeric Epic in small. Marcus was also an extreme Enya fan, even commissioning artists do do portraits of her for him, (Chris Dulabone has at least one of these portraits). I cannot speak much in favor of the SILLY OZBUL trilogy. If Roger Baum were not a direct descendant of LFB I doubt they would ever have been published. It is worth mentioning that the CD-ROM, "The Legends of Oz" includes all three of these tales, the first two minimally interactive. Tyler: I also have read Farmer's Riverworld books. I thought the concept was marvelous, but the final resolution was a disappointment after the long build up. I doubt Farmer knew when he started where he would be ending up. WICKED is now out in paper, and I finally got a copy (about 30 minutes ago). I have not had a chance to read it yet. It is now Wednesday afternoon, and I have not yet received my Spring BUGLE. Being a sustaining member does not always bring any benefits. BTW: The new illustrations by Lizbeth Zwerger for the North-South edition of WIIZARD are fascinating. I think I'll review it myself (especially since no one jumped at the chance). Jane: How did the Maguire talk go? Give up a report. Steve T. ====================================================================== Date: Wed, 16 Oct 1996 16:12:49 -0400 From: DavidXOE@aol.com Subject: Ozzy Digest, 10-16-96 Chris D.: I'm the one who wrote the review of HOW THE WIZARD SAVED OZ, but I don't want to get rid of my copy. If you don't get access to another copy after a while, E-mail me privately and I'll loan you my copy. Danny: Interesting about that edition of LAND. Wonder why they chose to excise all the illos of Tip? It's not as if kids that age typically dressed better than he did in the '50s, especially the late '50s. (That's the era of GREASE and WEST SIDE STORY, for cake's sake.) Dick: Well, you see, I didn't know your mother. (At least, I can't imagine that I did. And I certainly didn't know her when she was the age of that Ozma illo...) Incidentally, I heard back from Bill Stillman about that alphabet; it doesn't exist in digital form at present, and as far as he knows it's only authorized for use in the BUGLE. He suggested asking Peter Hanff about it, so I've done that, but only today so I haven't heard back yet. Bear: There was some discussion of Beach Blanket BabylOZ on the Digest some months ago. It's a real book, but as I recall the title is mostly a joke. Michael Patrick Hearn is a real expert on Oz, but whoever wrote that blurb obviously isn't. Robin: I've glanced through all the books in which Neill draws Ozma in fitted dresses, and there isn't another one like the one on p. 83 of WH unless it's in a part of a book where Ozma isn't actually on stage. (How's this for a monumental research project - a tally by page number of every illustration in every 1st edition book of the FF, with all characters listed. And then cross-indexed by character. Not as formidable with a computer and a database program as it would have been with, say, 3x5 cards, but formidable enough. Sounds like a way to while away a good many hours if you're snowbound or something... And then there's the question of what to do when a picture is clearly misidentified, like the one of Trot in GH that's labeled "Dorothy at home in Oz". Should it be listed as "Dorothy" or "Trot"?) Tyler: I may be the only other person you know who's read TO YOUR SCATTERED BODIES GO, but I know a lot of other people who have. In fact, I'm pretty sure it won the Hugo the year it was eligible. I read it and the second, and maybe the third, Riverworld books, but the series didn't seem to be going anywhere and it wasn't interesting enough to me to keep reading it after that. David Hulan ====================================================================== Date: Wed, 16 Oct 1996 13:42:33 -0700 From: MALCOLM D BARKER Subject: Oz For all you film buffs: There is a new Lazerdisc version of the MGM classic available I saw in Tower records last weekend that says it has THX sound and French and Spanish in secondary audio channels. Hallmark has a Wicked Witch (w/broom) Christmas ornament. Dave: I was thinking about going to the South Winkies Convention but have been very busy and didn't know if I could come for sure, figuring I could get tickets there, but checking the web site, I find now I would have needed tickets in advance, DRAT! Would have really liked to have came, even though I have had to watch my funds lately. Of course I'll buy your book, soon as funds permit. I've read all the first 14 and am anxious to read the rest of the FF, but I'll read your book first, just because it's yours so I can help give my critical review on the digest. I'd like to get the other oz books, too, all of them, am feeling badly now that so many are already unavailable, hoping someday there will be reprints, would be great to collect them all, I'm sure, (soon as funds permit!). Malcolm ====================================================================== Date: Wed, 16 Oct 1996 21:27:43 -0400 (EDT) From: Richard Bauman <72172.2631@CompuServe.COM> Subject: Today's Oz Growls Tyler - I have also read Farmer's TO YOUR SCATTERED BODIES GO. So that's two! But not all of RIVERWORLD. Well, we have another Bear on the Digest. BOZZYBEAR???? Regards, The Other Bear (:<) ====================================================================== Date: Thu, 17 Oct 1996 00:22:57 -0400 From: Tyler Jones <104707.656@compuserve.com> Subject: Oz Homer: Chris historically (or perhaps hysterically) takes a long time to respond and get stuff out. This is the price of running a non-profit organization. However, you can view his available catalog on the digest of a couple days ago, or at my web site. David: Sadly, I agree with your quality-assessment of _Sea Fairies_. I have owned my copy of _Sky Island_ for over 20 years, and I have always loved it. I knew of the existence of _Sea Fairies_, and for years I sought this book to read the "original" Trot story. When I finally receieved it, I was a little disapointed with the story, although I liked the idea of the mermaid's and their underground palace. Chris, Paper prices have been going up over the last few years, so it's no wonder that the basic Buckethead book is now $12.00. Of course, there are some great deals on older BEOO offerings, as you can see on my web page. Bear: _Beach Blanket BabylOz_ is no joke. It is awaiting publication. The title invokes images of scantily-clad women at play on the beach and in the ocean, but I cannot imagine Chris writing or publishing an Oz book like that. Maybe the title is misleading. Aaron: I'll post your review of _Sail Away_ as soon as I have some free time. I'd like to post your reviews of the Silly OzBul trilogy, but I am unwilling to do a Books of Wonder review page without tacit approval from Peter Glassman. While there is no legal bar to me doing this, I do not want to upset anybody without a good reason. --Tyler Jones ====================================================================== Date: Thu, 17 Oct 1996 02:20:56 -0400 (EDT) From: Gili Bar-Hillel Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-16-96 Bear - you betcha Michael Patrick Hearn knows Baum's real name! Are you kidding? This is the guy who wrote "The Annotated Wizard of Oz" (and had it published by the time he was my age...), who edited the Schocken Critical Heritage series edition of the book, which includes a HIGHLY recommended collection of critical essays about the Oz books, and who is now working on what will surely be the ultimate biography of Baum. If Hearn doesn't know his Oz and Baum, I don't know who does! The book you came across is probably the same one that Eric has and holds in such great esteem. As indeed he should. relatively Spoilerless review: I had time over the weekend to read Shanowers "The Giant Garden of Oz": I really really liked it! Some people have described this book as dark and scary, and this is true in a way, but ultimately the book has a happy, thought provoking end - I like the fact that Shanower gave a thought to how carelessly used magic could disrupt the ecology of Oz. Also, Shanowers illustrations are - well, they are Shanower's illustrations! And the story is probably better written than many of the FF books... Imogene the cow is a delightful new character. My one problem with the book was how out of character Billina seemed to be. Personally, I can't imagine her keeping quiet for a moment and not striking up any conversations with, say, Aunt Em in the first chapter of the book. My Baum Bugle arrived in Israel, my mother says. So I shall have to wait a couple of weeks before it reaches me here... |\ _,,,---,,_ /,`.-'`' -. ;-;;,_ Gili Bar-Hillel, |,4- ) )-,_..;\ ( `'-' abhillel@fas.harvard.edu '---''(_/--' `-'\_) gili@scso.com (cat by Felix Lee) http://www.scso.com/~gili ====================================================================== Date: Thu, 17 Oct 1996 10:16:36 -0400 (EDT) From: Mark Anthony Donajkowski Subject: not oz related but funny dave another fun thing from one of my lists Enjoy.......... 1. What's another word for thesaurus? 2. If a parsley farmer is sued, can they garnish his wages? 3. Why do steam irons have a permanent press setting? 4. Why do they lock gas station bathrooms? Are they afraid someone will clean them? 5. If the funeral procession is at night, do folks drive with their lights off? 6. If a turtle doesn't have a shell, is he homeless or naked? 7. Should vegetarians eat animal crackers? 8. If the cops arrest a mime, do they tell him he has the right to speak? 9. Why is the word abbreviation so long? 10. If you're cross-eyed and have dyslexia, can you read all right? What is the real meaning behind "Bad Girls?" TMB ====================================================================== ] c/ \ /___\ *** THE OZZY DIGEST, OCTOBER 19, 1996 *** |@ @| | V | \\\ |\_/| | ;;; \-/ \ ;/ >< ] ===================================================================== Date: Fri, 18 Oct 1996 17:58:31 -0400 From: "Melody G. Keller" <104270.2374@compuserve.com> Subject: Ozzy Digest, 10-18-96 Dave: How's your young computer? Is it an easy adjustment to Windows 95 from the Amiga operating system, or has it been a BIG adjustment? Everybody: Chris should have all he needs to publish Beach Blanket BabylOz--I sent him the cover art this week. As promised, the back cover features Trot and Dorothy about to toss Ozma into the surf. They're all in one-piece bathing suits. (Hey, Chis! This one ought to be your best-seller!) Melody Grandy ====================================================================== Date: Fri, 18 Oct 1996 19:33:39 -0400 From: DavidXOE@aol.com Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-18-96 An aside: I've volunteered at a local elementary school to read to some of the children - in my case, fourth and fifth graders. I was interested to see that the book that two of the kids chose for me to read from was by Gregory Maguire. (No, not WICKED! I forget the exact title, but it was something about spiders. Seemed a fairly decent kid's fantasy, scary but not horrifying. Of course, I haven't read the whole thing yet.) Melody: You don't have to pour money into computers at that great a rate, provided you don't want to do anything new with them. (That, of course, is the kicker!) Eventually, of course, it becomes impossible to get replacement parts and that sort of thing (and it happens a lot faster with computers than with, say, cars), but most computers are good for 7-8 years if you don't want new capabilities. Malcolm: I'm sure you don't need tickets in advance for the South Winkie convention, although I don't suppose you'll see this in time for it to do you any good. They do sell advance memberships, but I know that the two I went to sold memberships at the door as well. You probably need advance tickets for the meal, but since the convention is held right in the middle of downtown Dana Point there's no difficulty in going elsewhere to get something to eat - or you could bring your own lunch if you prefer. It's not as if there's that huge a crowd. And of course you should buy QUEEN ANN IN OZ and THE GLASS CAT OF OZ, which are also by Digest members, as well as LOCASTA AND THE THREE ADEPTS OF OZ when it appears... (At least they're cheaper than the non-Baum FF reprints.) Tyler: SKY ISLAND may well be my favorite Baum book (I waver between it and LOST PRINCESS). It has a really solid plot and very interesting characters; I've sometimes wished that Baum had been able to write more non-Oz books after it, because he seemed to be heading in a direction that I liked. On the other hand, all but one of my favorites among his Oz books wouldn't have been written if he had. Just for the record, the "Silly OZbuls" books are not published by Books of Wonder. They're published by something called "Yellow Brick Road Publications", which I suspect is Roger Baum's private label. BoW carried them, but they've carried books from Buckethead and other publishers as well. I can't imagine Peter Glassman getting upset if you posted Aaron's review of the Silly OZbuls book (though he might if you posted mine of HOW THE WIZARD SAVED OZ, which he -did- publish). Roger Baum might get upset, but he probably would never know. Gili: I agree with you that GIANT GARDEN is an excellent Oz book, better than some of the FF. But I think it's darker and scarier than any of the FF, even MAGICAL MIMICS (which comes the closest), even though it has a happy ending. (An Oz book without a happy ending would be completely heretical in spirit, I think.) All: I'm off to Cincinnati tomorrow and will go from there to Tennessee to visit my mother, so I won't be back until the 27th. Probably be a lot to catch up on by then! David Hulan ====================================================================== Date: Fri, 18 Oct 1996 21:07:04 -0400 (EDT) From: Richard Bauman <72172.2631@CompuServe.COM> Subject: TODAY'S OZ GROWLS Stephen - We get a lot of typos here but your latest has to be a classic of the genre......"artists do do portraits" Actually, I have been to MOMA in San Francisco and I think I can relate to that. Malcolm - In case someone else doesn't tell you, there are paperbacks of many of the FF and Books of Wonder, Reilly & Lee, and Oz Club reprint hardbacks of many too. Decide what you want next and ask the Digest for help. What are friends for? "Beach Blanket Babylon" is a show in San Francisco, that has been going on forever, where the characters wear gigantic hats. It is a variety show with racey lines. I saw it years ago. It was "entertaining." Maybe there is no relationship. At least I hope not. Since Melody did the illustrations I am sure it is worth a try. Tyler - You act like Peter Glassman will stop publishing Oz books if anyone gives one a negative review. I would think he would welcome discussion of his efforts and our feedback. That's free publicity. Even bad reviews get people to buy books. How many have bought WICKED after all the fussing about it? Jane - How did the Maguire meeting go? Gili - Calm yourself young lady. I am sure MPH knows his stuff. He clearly didn't write the blurb on the back of the book I bought. My comment was meant to be ironic. :) Dave - Glad to have you back with your system under control. Regards, Bear (:<) ====================================================================== Date: Fri, 18 Oct 1996 21:16:52 -0400 From: Tyler Jones <104707.656@compuserve.com> Subject: Oz Danny: Are you going to do The Soldier and the Guardian as a comedy duo? If so, would it spoiling it to reveal who is the straight man and who is the funny one? Beach Blanket BabylOz: It has been on the pile for quite some time now, so it is not surprising that some of you have heard of it. --Tyler Jones ====================================================================== Date: Fri, 18 Oct 1996 21:46:02 -0400 (EDT) From: Gili Bar-Hillel Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-18-96 Rebecca Bichel - As you must have gathered reading SJT's message, we have mentioned this specific edition in the digest recently. I think the illustrations are just fascinating: slightly surreal, very delicate... I would have volunteered to review but I think someone who knows more about art could do a better job than I. However, who published the calendar? That's one claendar I'd really like to have! Does the calendar also come with green glasses, like the book? Also, I just passed by Wordsworth again, they actually have an Oz display in the window! "Glass Cat" in not in the window (though we both know its on the shelf, don't we David!) but "Queen Anne" is! I think tomorrow I shall allow myself to splurge and buy a whole bunch of those... :-) |\ _,,,---,,_ /,`.-'`' -. ;-;;,_ Gili Bar-Hillel, |,4- ) )-,_..;\ ( `'-' abhillel@fas.harvard.edu '---''(_/--' `-'\_) gili@scso.com (cat by Felix Lee) http://www.scso.com/~gili ====================================================================== Date: Saturday 19-Oct-96 00:08:30 From: Dave Hardenbrook Subject: Ozzy Things MY "YOUNG" COMPUTER: Some Digest folks have kindly written asking how it's going setting up my new system. I've got it up and running now, and I'm slowly but surely adjusting to it and to Windows 95, although I will still be using my old faithful Amiga for things like Word Processing (e.g. Oz book writing) and putting together the Digest. The new system will be for "heavy-duty" tasks like 3D rendering and programming in Visual C++. (Actually, the most annoying I'm trying to get used to with the new system is that the space bar is split so that the right-hand half works as the backspace key -- very frustrating for someone used to hitting the space with his right thumb!) BEACH BLANKET BABYLOZ: Bear wrote: >"Beach Blanket Babylon" is a show in San Francisco, that has been going on >forever, where the characters wear gigantic hats. Isn't "Beach Blanket Babylon" also (and originally) the name of one of those Annette Funicello beach movies? SOUTH WINKIES CONVENTION: Well tommorrow's the day I've been waiting all year for! :) I hope to see at least a few of you there! David mentioned that you don't need tickets in advance for the South Winkie convention. Actually, that is not the case. I think last Saturday was the last day to register. They need your $$$ beforehand to pay for the lunch and the usage of the room, I think. People are bringing things for show-and-tell, and I've decided to bring (along with some of my illos. for _Locasta_ and screen shots of my web page) a hardcopy of today's Digest! Maybe I can recruit some new members! :) Weeeee're off to see the Convention, the wonderful Convention of Oz... :) -- Dave ====================================================================== ] c/ \ /___\ *** THE OZZY DIGEST, OCTOBER 21, 1996 *** |@ @| | V | \\\ |\_/| | ;;; \-/ \ ;/ >< ] ===================================================================== Date: Thu, 17 Oct 1996 22:49:50 -0500 From: International Wizard of Oz Club Subject: RE: link To: 'Wendy Wirick' Cc: Ozzy Digest Thanks, Wendy, we'll take a look! ---------- From: Wendy Wirick Sent: Saturday, October 12, 1996 7:30 PM To: iwoc@neosoft.com Subject: link Hello! I have recently published my "Wendy's Wonderful Wizard of Oz" home page on the Net. I am writing to inform you that I have a direct link here to your site. My address is: www.westol.com/~wizardoz/ I invite you to visit my page. It is an Oz Complete Directory. My goal is to guide anyone seeking Oz information, collectibles, publications, etc. to the proper source/proper site. Let me know what you think of my page! Thank you, Wendy ====================================================================== Date: Thu, 17 Oct 1996 23:33:05 -0500 From: International Wizard of Oz Club It would be great if someone who attends the South Winkie Convention would give us a summary of the weekend. And maybe some pictures to post on the web site? Jim ====================================================================== Date: Sat, 19 Oct 1996 05:26:47 -0700 (PDT) From: Eric Gjovaag Subject: Oz: TIK-TOK NEEDS HELP! Okay, everybody, now's your chance to help out two Digest subscribers who are in a bind. Neither Jane nor I have received ANY questions for the next "Talk to Tik-Tok" column in the "Oz Gazette" [children's publication of the International Wizard of Oz Club, for those wondering], so if anyone has any questions about the Oz books, movies, etc., that a child or beginning Oz fan might ask, please ask -- even if you know the answer . I'd prefer if you send the questions to me, but if you post them in the Digest, I can pull them from there as well. And if Jane (/me waves to her) has no objections, I can post the finished column here right after I send it to her. --Eric Gjovaag ### Visit my "Wizard of Oz" web site! http://www.eskimo.com/~tiktok/ ### ====================================================================== Date: Sat, 19 Oct 1996 09:20:20 -0400 From: DIXNAM@aol.com Subject: Ozzy Digest 10-18-96 Rebecca: Yes, I have seen and purchased the WoO illustrated by Lisbeth Zwerger. I saw it in Barnes & Noble about a month ago and was fascinated by the odd depictions of our old friends from Oz. At the bottom of two facing pages, she has a series of four drawings showing the progression of the Tin Woodman from flesh to tin. The book even comes with a pair of green glasses, which the reader is directed to wear when an eyeglass symbol is indicated on the page! At just under $20, its an affordable addition to anyone's collection. Malcolm: You won't be able to buy Dave's book for a while, according to what he tells us, as Buckethead has a long list of books to be published ahead of his. The Hallmark "Wicked Witch" ornament has been available for some time now, along with the musical ornament of the "famous four" . Dick Randolph ====================================================================== Date: Sat, 19 Oct 1996 12:49:42 -0400 (EDT) From: Nathan DeHoff Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-19-96 David: Which of the Baum books written before _Sky Island_ was one of your favorites? I would probably guess _Land_. That is probably my favorite early Baum Oz book. _Wizard_ and _Ozma_ are also good. Tyler: I would imagine that the Guardian would be the straight man, if he and the Soldier were teamed up. Nathan M. DeHoff ====================================================================== Date: Sat, 19 Oct 1996 14:39:57 -0400 (EDT) From: Mark Anthony Donajkowski Subject: oz bookmark i have a bmp of that ozbookmark i talked about if anyonewantsthe file writeme and ill send it to them ====================================================================== Date: Sat, 19 Oct 1996 12:00:42 -0700 (PDT) From: Peter Hanff Subject: Death of Oz Club's Jim Nitch Reported Dave, Dorothy Nitch has asked us to notify Oz friends that her beloved husband, Jim Nitch, died suddenly at their home in Encino, California, yesterday (Friday, October 18. Jim was a long-time Club member and a former member of the Board of Directors. He was also a frequent participant in Ozmopolitan Conventions and a constant participant in the Winkie and South Winkie Conventions. Dorothy has asked that people write to her rather than telephone (Jim's and Dorothy's friends are legion, so it would indeed be an intrusion to call). Dorothy's address is: 16720 Bajio Road Encino, CA 91436 Peter ====================================================================== Date: Sat, 19 Oct 1996 18:45:52 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Olderman Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-19-96 >>Weeeee're off to see the Convention, the wonderful Convention of Oz... :) I'm jealous, I'm jealous, I'm jealous! It's 4:35 California time and So. Winkies is going on and I'm here in dumb ol' Houston. I hope someone remembered to hug Langley for me. I hope someone reports on the convention for us. Malcolm, etc.:Yes, feel free to ask DIGESTERs for help in getting books. I have many of the Del Rays. I bought them when they came out and regret the purchase; they just clutter up the shelf and I never read 'em. I have all of the books in hardcover. I m perfectly willing to sell pbs at a reasonable non-dealer price, and I suspect others here are, too. I also have some of the white bound hbs. E-mail me if you want. robino@tenet.edu ====================================================================== Date: Sat, 19 Oct 1996 20:10:08 -0400 From: RMorris306@aol.com Subject: Oz Comics, Oz Informants et al Hi again! Since I've received several requests for more information about the Oz-related Supergirl comic book story I mentioned, I figured I might as well run it here. It was "The Mysterious Motr of Doov" by writer Cary Bates and artist Win Mortimer, in ADVENTURE COMICS #394 (1970). Supergirl and her pet, Streaky the Super-Cat, were transported to another dimension, and hooked up with three other strange creatures who needed help (one of them coincidentally resembling Leon the Neon from THE WICKED WITCH OF OZ) to seek out the one man there who could send them back. He sent them to face the Wicked One of the West, but turned out to be another American stranded in this land. He did manage to send both himself and Supergirl home, and since he'd come from Chicago in 1898, Supergirl theorized that he'd later told his story to L. Frank Baum. Years earlier, DC had published "The Wizard of Wisstark," featuring the Seven Soldiers of Victory (a team featuring Green Arrow, Vigilante, and several other minor DC characters) in LEADING COMICS #7 in 1943. The Seven Soldiers visited a hidden land in Antarctica, ruled by a Wizard who, once again, proved to be a displaced American with no real magic powers. But, apart from the basic setup, the story (by write Joe Samachson and artist Pierce Rice) seemed closer to the 1925 WIZARD movie (with Larry Semon and Oliver Hardy) than to any of the original Oz movies. THE BAUM BUGLE had an issue a few years back focusing on Oz in the comics, and touched on these stories (at least the Supergirl one) as well as a DC parody "The Wizard of Ooze" that featured Jerry Lewis in Dorothy's role, the Marvel adaptations of WIZARD and LAND, and one or two of Eric Shanower's early stories. Yet there seems to be a specific aspect of Superman lore, though a recent addition, that may be directly attributable to Oz. Traditionally Superman's home base has been the fictional city of Metropolis, and he grew up in the equally fictitious suburb of Smallville. Neither city was ever placed in a specific state, and Metropolis still hasn't been...but, upon taking over Superman in 1986, John Byrne (a writer/artist whose work on the character I detested at the time...I've since come to appreciate his other work somewhat more, but still contend that Superman was far from his finest hour) established Smallville as being in a specific state--Kansas. I don't actually see the point either of placing a fictional city in a real state..especially since neither Byrne nor anyone else involved with Superman ever (to my knowledge) lived in Kansas or had any connection with it. (I've heard it said that he got it from the 1978 Christopher Reeve movie, but I've seen that movie twice and nobody ever mentions the state in the Smallville sequences. If it was ever identified, it's by some very obscure reference like the call letters of the radio station Clark Kent listens to.) The best I can think of was that it might be a reaction to the Oz books, which had a child from a Kansas farm go to a magical place "over the rainbow" and eventually make her home there. Byrne may have considered it appropriate to have a child from "over the rainbow" make his home on a Kansas farm. And didn't both Superman and the MGM Wizard of Oz movie first appear in 1938? Even more ironically, the 1938 Oz book was THE SILVER PRINCESS OF OZ, in which Planetty came from another planet (a/k/a Anuther Planet) to live in Oz. She even married an Oz native, Prince Randy...and, though it's taken him 58 years to catch up, Superman finally married Lois Lane this very month! As for the "informant" theory, I enjoy it, even though it may need to be taken with a grain of salt in cases like the conversation between Ruggedo and Kiki Aru, both of whom forgot it before the end of the book. (Despite his joking claims to be recording the history of a real person, he functions to a large extent as an omniscient narrator...mentioning, for instance, both Ruggedo's and Kiki's plans to betray their partner, which neither of them admitted to anyone.) I seem to recall David Hulan saying that RINKITINK was another of his favorite Oz books (it's my personal favorite, though perhaps the fact that I owned it and read it again and again underscored that), and that might have seen print in its original form if the Oz books hadn't all done so much better. With this in mind, I'm reminded of another question only obliquely related to Oz...it's at times like this that I miss Apanage, the children's fantasy apa, the most. A few months ago I saw the animated adaptation of THE PHANTOM TOLLBOOTH, the Norton Juster novel (which gave its name to Apanage's OO) illustrated by Jules Feiffer. The novel was similar to many of the Oz books (as well as the Wonderland, Narnia, and many other children's fantasies) in having a child...a boy named Milo, in this case...visit a world of fantasy, help the people there in the course of his adventures, and then return home. Juster's world was more overtly allegorical than Baum's or Carroll's (and more a social allegory than a religious one like C.S. Lewis's), but not all that dissimilar. But the movie (produced and directed by Chuck Jones, most famous for the numerous cartoons featuring Bugs Bunny, the Road Runner, and other characters he'd directed for Warner Bros.) ended up with the tollbooth flying out the window, and turning up at the home of Milo's friend Ralph (who, like Milo, had been bored with the world at the beginning, but learned to appreciate life more during his adventures). The implication was that Ralph would encounter adventures of his own, but I couldn't shake a question of my own. Would Ralph find himself in the same world Milo had, or a different one? If the same one, would it (a) be in the same negative condition Milo had found it in, or (b) be the virtual paradise it had become by the end of the movie? Neither was quite satisfactory; (a) would have undercut Milo's own achievements, and (b) would leave Ralph in a place possibly as boring as his own world. That's why I always expected the true answer was (c): that Ralph would be transported to a very different fantasy world, as much in need of a courageous American child with things to learn as Milo. (An in-joke on Jones' part also supports that contention: Ralph Phillips was a character carried over from his Warner Bros. days, essentially a child Walter Mitty who didn't exactly need a Phantom Tollbooth to have fantasy adventures.) But, now that I think of it, the Oz books are essentially the equivalent of situation (b)...after Dorothy got rid of the Wicked Witches in the first book, it did indeed become an Earthly (or unEarthly) paradise, much as if Norton Juster had continued to give Milo and/or other children further adventures in his world after the return of Rhyme and Reason. Juster didn't, as far as I know, and the fact that Baum did was seen by later librarians as largely overkill...but, after all, isn't there something to be said for an unEarthly paradise where we can (if, in our case, only in our dreams and imagination) always visit, have some none-too-dangerous adventures, and see our ageless friends like Dorothy and the Scarecrow and Ozma once again? Rich Morrissey ====================================================================== Date: Sat, 19 Oct 1996 20:55:41 -0400 From: "Melody G. Keller" <104270.2374@compuserve.com> Subject: Ozzy Digest, 10-19-96 Bear: > It (Beach Blanket Babylon) is a variety show with racey lines. Unless somebody redesktop publishes what I've done, Beach Blanket BabylOz is a good Oz story with NO racy lines. There are a couple places where harsh reality rears its ugly head (****Plot Spoiler**** Dorothy and Trot fleetingly become the elderly women they would have been had they not stayed in Oz, for one). But the characters mostly have a good time in the book. Bearing in mind (no pun intended) that you hate to see children's fantasies dragged through the mire, Buckley has not done it to Oz in this one. The two harsh realities are faced in the Great Outside World, not Oz, and there's no porno. By the way, sorry for the bad news about "Alice" being dragged through the mire. I wish that sort of thing could be stopped, too, but the vile mire-draggers would scream, "Censorship!" David Hardenbrook: Have a good time, Dave. Rather suspected you would put the Digest together on the Amiga--you would have to rewrite your entire Digest-assembling program for Windows '95! By the way, I've never worked with or seen an IBM clone with the split spacebar you describe. David Hulan: Would you two Davids believe that David is my father's first name? Yes, resisting the desire to do something new with one's computer IS a kicker. My Tandy 1000 lasted for 10 years, but gracious! The rate of bigger, faster, better is getting so furious I wonder if I will be able to get anything that runs on my 486/66Mhz two years from now(!) I hope the computer industry runs head on into some limit beyond which they cannot improve these things anymore! When I went to work at Golf Associates, it was the twenty-year-olds teaching ME how to do the job! That was a great opportunity to learn full-color desktop publishing--but the breakneck pace of technology sure has turned the old apprenticeship system on its head. Melody Grandy ====================================================================== Date: Sun, 20 Oct 1996 15:53:46 -0400 From: "Melody G. Keller" <104270.2374@compuserve.com> Subject: Ozzy Digest, 10-19-96 Dear Digesters, Since my Bugle has not yet arrived ( and here I live in the US, not Israel, Gili!), could somebody tell me if the review of Disenchanted Princess is in there? Please? Pretty please? Melody Grandy ====================================================================== Date: Sun, 20 Oct 1996 20:36:16 -0700 From: ozbot@ix.netcom.com (ozbot) Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest stuff Tyler-- Actually, a comedy team of the Guardian and the Soldier of the EC, it shouldn't be too hard to figure out who the straight man and who the funny man is. . . in most cartoons (and even most comedy duos) the tall, skinny one is the "straight man" to the short pudgy funny guy. Stereotypical, I guess, but in the comedy genre, stereotypes abound. Maybe if I get around to writing some Oz stories, I'll include "my version" of Guardian and Green Whiskers. Swinkies-- I went to South Winkies, too, (my very first Oz convention) and met our world famous Dave there, and I saw Herm, too, but didn't get a chance to meet him personally. This guy came all the way from New Jersey, folks, so be impressed! Oh, and I got lucky and won the Ozzy quiz based on the fist seven Oz books! (Lucky meaning that Eric weren't there!) 'til tomorrow, Danny ====================================================================== Date: Monday 21-Oct-96 03:21:34 From: Dave Hardenbrook Subject: Ozzy Things REPORT ON SOUTH WINKIE CONVENTION: Well, I'm back from South Winkies, and it was great! Two other Digest members, Danny and Herm B., were there, though I'm sure more from South Winkies will become Digesters soon as I will explain below. We came to order about 10:30AM and started with everyone introducing themselves, and then Show 'N Tell (which was much shorter this year than last). I showed my printouts of the Ozzy Digest and my Web page, although I couldn't get the picture of the Emerald City to print (still trying to figure out the new system); and Danny showed his character designs for his animated _Land of Oz_ plan. After Show 'N Tell we had lunch and socializing until the arrival of the guest of honor, who in the MGM _Wizard_ played the center member of the Lollipop Guild ( what's his name again, Danny and Herm? :) ). Then we had an auction that went on longer than Bill Clinton's 1988 Convention Dukakis nominating speech. :) But it was fun nonetheless. I finally got my hands on _The Oz-Wonderland War_ for $30, which filled me with buyer's remorse :) but I feel better when I think of it as a $30 donation to Buckethead (since Chris put it up for auction) which brings mine and others' books that much closer to publication. :) The sales tables were also chuck full of goodies, most of which I couldn't afford, including an edition of _Ozma of Oz_ featuring on the cover the famous "Slinky Ozma" picture and the words: "Ozma of Oz: Popular Edition" ( and you know why its "popular"-- because of that picture! :) :) :) ) After the official Convention adjourned, some of us went out to dinner, where we had more Ozzy discussions. I talked a lot about the Internet and the Ozzy Digest and I think I recruited some new members...We'll wait and see if there's an inundation of SUBSCRIBE messages in the next few days. :) -- Dave ====================================================================== ] c/ \ /___\ *** THE OZZY DIGEST, OCTOBER 22, 1996 *** |@ @| | V | \\\ |\_/| | ;;; \-/ \ ;/ >< ] ===================================================================== Date: Mon, 21 Oct 1996 18:40:15 -0400 From: Homer Wendy- Great page! It's very well put together. I quickly skimmed through the trivia, and saw that you have Buddy Ebsen down as the first Tinman. IIRC, wasn't it Ray Bolger who was the first Tinman before he and Ebsen exchanged parts? Maybe I'm missing something, but I was just wonderin... ====================================================================== Date: Mon, 21 Oct 1996 20:44:37 -0500 From: International Wizard of Oz Club Subject: RE: HELP! To: "'Romano, Tina'" Tina, I'm sending this on to the Ozzy Digest mailing list. Some of the book dealers who subscribe may be able to help you. Sincerely, Jim Vander Noot ---------- From: Romano, Tina Sent: Monday, October 21, 1996 12:06 PM To: 'iwoc@neosoft.com' Subject: HELP! Is there anybody out there that can help me? I've been sending various e-mail asking for help but no answer!! I desperately need to know if it's possible to buy a copy of "The Annotated Wizard of Oz" , "To Please a Child" and "The Wizard of Oz and Who he Was" Gardner&Nye and "Wonderful Wizard Marvelous Land", Raylyn Moore. I disperately need these books and I can't follow on with my Thesis. Photocopies will do as well. Your help is highly appreciated. Tank You Tina Maria Romano ====================================================================== Date: Mon, 21 Oct 1996 21:04:03 -0500 From: International Wizard of Oz Club Subject: RE: stage script To: 'O'Connell' There are a number of Oz-related stage plays, However I don't know off = hand where to find them. You could check the Library of Congress, or = Samuel French in N.Y. Sincerely, Jim Vander Noot ---------- From: O'Connell Sent: Friday, October 11, 1996 7:41 AM To: iwoc@neosoft.com Subject: stage script Hi ! I came across your page as I was looking for a stage script. My friend's child's school wants to do an adaptation of the movie and I was=20 wondering if you could help me. Thanks. Mrs O'Connell ====================================================================== Date: Mon, 21 Oct 1996 22:48:02 -0500 From: International Wizard of Oz Club Subject: FYI - For the Ozzy Digest ---------- From: International Wizard of Oz Club Sent: Monday, October 21, 1996 10:47 PM To: 'Wendy Wirick' Subject: RE: link Wendy, I just took a look at your page and it's great! Your graphics are = tasteful and perform well. Your use of color is very effective, and = you've got a comprehensive reference for the MGM film. Thanks for the = link! =20 Sincerely, Jim Vander Noot =20 ---------- From: Wendy Wirick Sent: Friday, October 18, 1996 10:23 AM To: International Wizard of Oz Club Subject: Re: link Hello!=20 I apologize for not getting back to you prior to this time. My server has had difficulty with email since last weekend, and I just today received your message sent 10-12-96. I am interested to know your opinion of my page. Also, I have updated and added an "over the rainbow" midi as well. Let me know what you think, please!! I want it to be worthy of the OZ name, and respect the opinion of the IWOC. Thank you! Wendy ------------------------------------- International Wizard of Oz Club wrote: >=20 > Thanks, Wendy, we'll take a look! >----------------------------------------------------------------------=20 > I am writing to inform you that I have a direct link here > to your site. My address is: www.westol.com/~wizardoz/ I invite = you to visit my page. It is an Oz Complete Directory. ====================================================================== Date: Mon, 21 Oct 1996 07:20:06 -0800 (PST) From: earlabbe@juno.com (Earl C. Abbe) Subject: Ozzy Digest Submission I have returned from autumn colorful New Hampshire (by way of Philadelphia) to find 43 e-mails waiting for me in the inbox. It will take a while to get through them all. In Philadelphia I noticed a bill board ad campaign for home mortgages. The central icon in the ads is the Pennsylvania automobile license plate with the friend slogan on the top and some vanity palate number like "GR8 R8S". The one that really caught my eye said, "YOU'VE GOT A FRIEND IN PENNSYLVANIA" - "SPEEDY". Well, yes, at least until he returned to Oz.. Bear says in the 10/11 Digest, Unfortunately, _Alice's Adventures in Wonderland_ has many times been begrimed in film or the printed word for political or pornographic purposes. ====================================================================== Date: Mon, 21 Oct 1996 10:28:01 -0400 From: DIXNAM@aol.com Subject: Ozzy Digest 10-21-96 Melody: Yes, "Disenchanted Princess" IS reviewed in the current issue of the Bugle, quite favorably by Phyllis Karr. (:-) Dave: The "Lollipop Kid" is Jerry Maren. Was his wife Elizabeth there also? The were both at the '95 Munchkin con. How many people attended South Winkies? From your report it sounds like a small group. I get the feeling that Herm attends most Oz conventions. Wendy Wirick's web page is well worth a look! Dick Randolph ====================================================================== Date: Mon, 21 Oct 1996 09:03:06 -0700 From: ozbot@ix.netcom.com (ozbot) Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest stuff Informant theory-- FOr those wondering about the informant theory and the case of the omniscient narrator, a couple of ponderables-- 1) That a book is, even with an informant, a dramatization of events by the author. This also explains why certain details change from book to book and author to author, and also explains why Roquat "becomes" Ruggedo. (He threatened a libel suit and Baum changed his name to protect the "innocent.") 2) It is not uncommon for Ozma and Dorothy to watch the magic picture or read from Glinda's great Book, and could have later found out much of the information that is related to Baum for a book (I think someone suggested this as a reason that Hyup is discovered.) Heck, these gals even look in the picture and read the book *while* the other heroes or villans are doing their deeds! Eric (-er- Tiktok,) I have a couple of questions I thought of, if you want to work them into the Gazette, but others can respond if they want. . . 1) Are all witches destroyed by water? (I know the West was, and Cosgrove-Payes mentions that Singra "was," but doesn't Mombi drink from the fountain? Wouldn't this have melted her?) 2) What is the WOozy made of? (Isn't there some mention of beehive ancestry? Thompson mentions he is made of wood, but that struck me as kind of odd, as I think he is "meat" and needs to sleep, eat and -er, well, just eat and sleep, I guess.) Danny ====================================================================== Date: Mon, 21 Oct 1996 14:21:52 -0600 (CST) From: Ruth Berman Subject: ozzy digest Dave Hardenbrook: Congratulations on getting your new system up and running so quickly. And thanks for Winkie gathering report. Depending on how much word-processing you're doing at a stretch -- watch out for repetitive stress injury to your thumb (whichever one you use on the space bar). If you find one day that your thumb makes a clicking noise when you bend it, and it hurts to use it, head at once to a doctor. (I eventually had to have my right thumb operated on, and although the operation relieved the pain, I can feel that neither thumb wants to be used for hitting space bars, and I've been using the middle fingers instead.) Steve Teller: Your explanation of "Sail Away to Oz" sounds rather off-putting. While I don't know Marcus Mebes, his friend, or his friend's girl-friend, in general, the habit of saying that if something goes wrong in a relationship between a man and a woman, it must be her fault, and if it's her fault she must be an evil woman, and if he can't break off the relationship that must be her fault, too -- usually reflects male chauvinist piggishness rather than anything that could laughingly be called reality. Gili Bar-Hillel: Was interested by your review of "Giant Garden of Oz." A quibble: strictly speaking, Imogene the cow can't be a delightful new character in it. Delightful she can, but not new -- she comes out of Baum's 1902 stage version of "Wizard." ====================================================================== Date: Mon, 21 Oct 1996 21:21:54 -0400 (EDT) From: "Aaron S. Adelman" Subject: _Dorothy and the Lizard of Oz_ Empire Greetings, folks. I have yet another book to review, but there's no need to get out the asbestos clothing; it's not scathing. It's not nice either. ***ENTER SPOILER MODE*** The Victim: _Dorothy and the Lizard of Oz_ by Richard A. Gardner, M.D. This book unfortunately lives up to its bad reputation as a misinterpretation of _The Wonderful Wizard of Oz_, which is a pity since the author writes well and could have written a good story based on the principles upon which he founded this one. In fact, his sticking with the basically the same story as the movie (he got permission to plagarize from MGM) hampers the message he was trying to convey. If the Great Wizard only gives quick, easy solutions and the Lizard only gives slow, complex ones, why does the Great Wizard demand that Dorothy and co. bring him the broomstick of the Witch of the West? And if the Great Wizard's solutions don't really work in the long run, why does the balloon which he gave Dorothy to take her to Kansas take her there quickly and flawlessly?=20 After all, she didn't ask him to protect Toto from Miss Gulch, but only to send her home. Also puzzling is why the Scarecrow, the Tin Woodman, and the Cowardly Lion think that they have a brain, heart, and courage respectively because they have a diploma, testimonial, and medal, which does strike me as a flagrant misinterpretation of the movie. All in all, a rather confusing book. ***END SPOILER*** Not related to the above: Having gotten some birthday money (thank you, Grampa!) I intend to add a few Oz books to the Adelman collection. Does anyone know if Laumer is still in the USA? Aaron Solomon (ben Saul Joseph) Adelman adelman@yu1.yu.edu ====================================================================== Date: Tue, 22 Oct 1996 14:20:44 -0400 (EDT) From: MICHAEL TURNIANSKY Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-19-96 > > Isn't "Beach Blanket Babylon" also (and originally) the name of one > of those Annette Funicello beach movies? I believe you are thinking of "Beach Blanket Bingo", m'lad. --Mike "Shaggy Man" Turniansky, who's been lurking of late ====================================================================== ] c/ \ /___\ *** THE OZZY DIGEST, OCTOBER 23, 1996 *** |@ @| | V | \\\ |\_/| | ;;; \-/ \ ;/ >< ] ===================================================================== Date: Tue, 22 Oct 1996 19:48:21 -0400 (EDT) From: Nathan DeHoff Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-22-96 Danny: The Hungry Tiger, in _Wishing Horse_, states that the Woozy is made of wood and does not need to eat. This is obviously a mistake. The Woozy eats in Baum's books. He was locked up because he ate the Munchkins' bees. Also, in a letter to Neill, which was printed in a recent Baum Bugle, Baum specifically says that the Woozy is not made of wood. Singra is not destroyed by water. A Water Nymph makes her immune to the substance. She drinks some of the Water of Oblivion, which seems to affect her, but we cannot really tell, since she is put to sleep soon afterwards. Mombi is destroyed by water, at the end of _Lost King_. Earlier in that book, Mombi states that water is "death and destruction to all witches," but this is probably an exaggeration. Coo-ee-oh, a Krumbic Witch, submerges and is not destroyed. Glinda, a Good Witch, attends a water party in _Scalawagons_. It seems that only a certain type of witch can be melted by water. Nathan M. DeHoff ====================================================================== Date: Tue, 22 Oct 1996 20:13:42 -0400 From: RMorris306@aol.com Subject: Recent Ozzy Digests Hi again! Eric Gjovaag wrote: <.>> You've got some now. (And they're mostly questions I had *as* a child, so they're not out of character...even though people on the Digest have largely answered them by now. Nathan DeHoff wrote: <> While Danny wrote: <> Well, Danny's often right (Abbott and Costello, Mutt and Jeff, Fred Flintstone and Barney Rubble, Asterix and Obelix, and many others come to mind), but I can think of quite a number of counterexamples (Laurel and Hardy, Jackie Gleason and Art Carney, the two stars of LA CAGE AUX FOLLES...even Spanky and Alfalfa or Daffy Duck and Porky Pig!) as well. In this case, Omby Amby is a funny enough character and the Guardian, in his brief appearances, was played straighter, so I'd be more likely to agree with Nathan. Danny also asked: <<1) Are all witches destroyed by water? (I know the West was, and Cosgrove-Payes mentions that Singra "was," but doesn't Mombi drink from the fountain? Wouldn't this have melted her?)>> I don't think there's any evidence of that. Since Thompson's having Mombi melted was one of her worst moments in an otherwise excellent book, I'd just like to assume that was a weakness peculiar to one or two witches in Oz. <<2) What is the WOozy made of? (Isn't there some mention of beehive ancestry?>> That was from a March Laumer story in OZIANA, and wasn't at all official. <> Baum specifically said he was *not* made of wood in a letter to Neill, recently quoted in THE BAUM BUGLE. He also asked that one particular picture of the Woozy that actually showed a wood grain on his skin not be used...but it not only was, but ended up being used to represent the character in WHO'S WHO IN OZ. Little wonder Thompson, who may have confused him with the Sawhorse, thought he was made of wood. Danny Homer wrote: <> Actually, if you want to get technical, wasn't David Montgomery the first Tinman? Earl Abbe wrote: < Unfortunately, _Alice's Adventures in Wonderland_ has many times been begrimed in film or the printed word for political or pornographic purposes.>> I think David Hulan mentioned Jan Needle's THE WILD WOOD, which was a Marxist retelling of THE WIND IN THE WILLOWS with Toad as an evil capitalist and the weasels as the heroes. He liked it, though the only other person I know who read it, Diana Wynne Jones, hated it. You pays your money and takes your choice. As for WINNIE-THE-POOH, P.G. Wodehouse tossed a few uncharacteristic jabs Milne's way in his 1949 short story "Rodney Has a Relapse" (featuring sentimental poet/golfer Rodney Spelvin and his son "Timothy Bobbin"), but that was aimed more at Milne's verse than at Pooh. (Milne had been, to put it mildly, unsympathetic about Wodehouse's broadcasts while a German captive during World War II.) Parenthetically, it seems a bit unfair that, while Milne's children's verse is still in print alongside his great fantasies, Baum's (FATHER GOOSE) isn't. Granted that a handful of the poems wouldn't work because of racial stereotypes, the vast majority would delight today's children as much as Milne's do. Fredrick Crews in the early '60's wrote THE POOH PERPLEX, criticizing the Pooh books in the style of most of the famous critics of the day...but his satirical jabs were aimed straight at the critics, not at Milne. Pooh has since been featured in various philosophical books whose writer I forget (THE TAO OF POOH and THE TE OF PIGLET), but, as far as I know, without violence to Milne's characters and with the permission of his estate. Rich Morrissey ====================================================================== Date: Tue, 22 Oct 1996 21:00:31 -0400 (EDT) From: Richard Bauman <72172.2631@CompuServe.COM> Subject: TODAY'S OZ GROWLS I think I am in the pre-Halloween slump. My wife is going to the annual party as Glinda (as in the book) not a poofy Billy Burke, even though we are supposed to be characters from a favorite movie. Me, I'm going as Bruce Willis in "Die Hard!" The costume for the wizard would be a bit too expensive to assemble. Are any of the rest of you doing an Oz character for Halloween? ERIC - If I was a kid (I mean other than at heart) the first thing I would like to know about Oz is how do you get there if you don't have a cyclone handy? Oh, and I'm still waiting to hear if you got a job or are living off the rest of us? :) Regards, Bear (:<) ====================================================================== Date: Tue, 22 Oct 1996 21:59:29 -0400 From: Ozisus@aol.com Subject: Oz game for sale Saw this posted: Subject: FS: ANTIQUE WIZARD OF OZ BOARD GAME From: games@bright.net (Lyle Rhodebeck) Date: 8 Oct 1996 20:16:58 GMT Message-ID: <53ecrq$hc0@cletus.bright.net> I have the original 1921 (pre-movie) board game based on the Wizard of Oz for sale. It was made by Parker Brothers based on the L. Frank Baum books. This large board game comes with wonderful color lithography on the box cover, and a gorgeous color game board. This version has wooden pawns, dice cup and very old dice. Overall, the box and parts are in superb condition for their age (75 years old) and I would rate it a condition 8 on a scale of 1-10. It is priced at $600. Email if interested. Thank you. Lyle Rhodebeck ====================================================================== Date: Tue, 22 Oct 1996 23:23:37 -0400 (EDT) From: Gili Bar-Hillel Subject: books on Oz Tina, The books you are interested in can probably all be ordered through an inter-library loan. Asides from that, I was recently surprised and pleased to discover that "The Wizard of Oz and Who he Was" is available through the online book-order service Amazon Books. I don't know the exact URL, but if you have netscape access it should be very easy to find in a simple search - it's a huge business. Also, I'm sure that I'm speaking for all the subscribers to the Ozzy digest when I say that we would be very interested to hear more about your thesis. Perhaps we could even help - some of the digest subscribers have formidable Ozzy resources and knowledge. To subscribe, Gili wrote: >... simply write a >message to Dave Hardenbrook at: DAVE47@delphi.com. Good luck! |\ _,,,---,,_ /,`.-'`' -. ;-;;,_ Gili Bar-Hillel, |,4- ) )-,_..;\ ( `'-' abhillel@fas.harvard.edu '---''(_/--' `-'\_) gili@scso.com (cat by Felix Lee) http://www.scso.com/~gili ====================================================================== Date: Tue, 22 Oct 1996 23:36:14 -0400 (EDT) From: Gili Bar-Hillel Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-22-96 Ruth Berman - I don't know if you read "The Giant Garden of Oz", but Imogene, who is almost certainly named after the stage version cow, is a different cow. Unlike the stage-cow, she is not from Kansas originally - also, (slight but charming spoiler) every time you milk her she gives a different liquid, depending on her mood: chocolate milk, cream, milk-shakes... Kinda cute, don't you think? |\ _,,,---,,_ /,`.-'`' -. ;-;;,_ Gili Bar-Hillel, |,4- ) )-,_..;\ ( `'-' abhillel@fas.harvard.edu '---''(_/--' `-'\_) gili@scso.com (cat by Felix Lee) http://www.scso.com/~gili ====================================================================== Date: Tue, 22 Oct 1996 23:43:21 -0400 From: Tyler Jones <104707.656@compuserve.com> Subject: Oz This post contains a review of the last three days due to hectic times... Reviews and such: For those of you who don;t know what's going on, let me fill you in... On my personal web site, I have a lot of Ozzy stuff, including a page that lists all current Oz books by Buckethead Enterprises of Oz, a non-profit company dedicated to publishing Oz books. I also have a page of reviews where people can voice their opinions of the various BEOO offerings. Some people have suggested I do a page of reviews for BOW books. I would like to do this, but I am unsure how Peter Glassman, the head of BOW, would take it. There is no legal bar to my publishing reviews and comment about ANY subject I want, but I do not want to cause any rifts in the Ozzy community, so I am awaiting an "OK" by Peter before I put this up. There are many fine BOW books that I would like to review, such as _Glass Cat_, _Queen Ann_, _Giant Garden_ and others. Of course, there are some not-so-fine BOW books that I want to gripe about. Bear made a good point about it being free publicity, since I would also post BOW's address and 800 number. I may just set it up anyway, and if Peter asks me to take it down, I will. David: My personal Baum favorite is _Queen Zixi_, but _Sky Island_ comes very close. SWINKIES: It is too bad that I could make the South Winkies Con, but maybe next year. Rich: If only the first book is considered, then Dorothy's visit indeed had far- reaching effects in Oz. Both Wicked Witches had been eliminated, as well as the mysterious Wizard (although not a permanently as the witches). With Glinda and Locasta/Tattypoo as the only remaining "superpowers", Oz would have truly been a "perfect" paradise, but of course to keep the series exciting, Baum needed to invent some more baddies from time to time. Melody: It seems to me that there should be some kind of upper limit on processing power, although when and if we reach that level, we'll just link them together and have multi-processors. I forgot the technical term, but who knows where this will end? However, there may be no theoretical limit on the amount of memory. Danny: Your arguements regarding the "informant" theory are precisely why such things, including the HACC, are not and cannot be perfect sciences, nor can they generate absolutes. I still believe in the successive approximation model, though, and that is one thing that keeps it going. --Tyler Jones ====================================================================== Date: Wed, 23 Oct 1996 00:29:53 -0400 From: HermBieber@aol.com Subject: For Ozzy Digest Help! Does anyone know the whereabouts of former subscriber David Bedell? I had some book information for him, and it was undeliverable. He was at the Univ. of Bridgeport, CT, and probably left campus, and thus lost his e-mail address. ---------------- Re: S. Winkie Convention The guest little people were the Marens, Jerry and wife, Elizabeth, who gave a very entertaining account of Jerry's experiences with the 1939 movie and his other roles in the world of stage and screen. They were introduced by Dave Cox, whose second book on the Munchkins (the first was "The Munchkins Remember") is at the printer now. The lunch (deli sandwiches & salads) was better than any lunch I have had at the national IWOC conventions. (Yes, I have attended almost all of the three major conventions for the past 15 years, but this was my first one at Dana Point.) Jim Nitch was supposed to give a presentation on the specially printed bound volume of Fred Otto's Oziads but sadly passed away the day before. The auction contained no surprises. It was heavy on ephemera and short on quality books. One interesting item was a galley proof of Eric Shanower's new book on the non-Oz works of Jack Snow. ---------------- For Tina, Yes, I usually have the books you seek, but am momentarily out of To Please A Child. I have lots of Annotated Wizards and a cheap ex-libris copy of The Wizard of Oz and Who He Was. As to Wonderful Wizard, Marvelous Land, I'm pretty sure I have one left, but it seems to be "lost" among the miscellaneous Ozzy piles in my basement and cellar. Hope to find it, though. If interested, please e-mail me privately for prices. Herm Bieber ====================================================================== Date: Wed, 23 Oct 1996 01:11:59 -0400 (EDT) From: "Aaron S. Adelman" Subject: Do all witches melt in Oz? Empire Danny, I was under the impression that only old, dried out witches, probably due to a side effect of a spell commonly used in black magic, melted in water, though I wouldn't place a bet on what would happen if one doused Zixi or even Glinda. Mombi wasn't forced to drink by Glinda from the Fountain of Oblivion; rather she was forced to drink a potion designed to make her forget all the magic she knew. Also, the Woozy tells me that he is made of flesh, albeit in a strange shape. The beehive thing is only in the Laumerian universe, and trust me, you don't want to hear a fuller description than that. In the Adelmanian universe, he was created by Hiergargo the Magician, but you'll have to wait for the publication of _The Woozy Oz_ to learn much more of his history. Now if only the people at Tor would get back to me... Aaron Solomon (ben Saul Joseph) Adelman adelman@yu1.yu.edu ====================================================================== Date: Tue, 22 Oct 1996 11:47:30 -0400 From: OzBucket@aol.com Subject: THIRD BOOK Do you know anyone who has copies of the original Queer Visitors stories, either from ancient newspapers or Bugles? I am trying to find the original dates each story was printed in newspapers. Also, I'd like a comparison with *3rd Book*. I know that at least the Wogglebug Book was (ugh, choke, gasp) cleaned of its racial slurs and rendered PC, much like BoW's Dot & Tot and Patchwork Girl and Shanower's Sam Steele. FWIW, I was not informed of the PCism until long after I had already offered the book. Had I known in advance, I would not have been willing to do it. This is a brand of censorship that is not acceptable, and I am ashamed to have offered such a book. In any event, I no longer have the book on my list. I do, however, have a short stack of copies signed by Shanower which I take to Conventions to sell. If I get the dates, and any PI parts, I may eventually decide to offer a PROPER edition. But don't hold your breath. I am sorta hoping the Club will do one in full color... ====================================================================== ] c/ \ /___\ *** THE OZZY DIGEST, OCTOBER 24, 1996 *** |@ @| | V | \\\ |\_/| | ;;; \-/ \ ;/ >< ] ===================================================================== Date: Wed, 23 Oct 1996 15:29:00 +0100 (MET) From: "Romano, Tina" Subject: RE: books on Oz Thanks to evrybody for your help! I would definitely like to subscribe. My thesis is primarly about "The Wonderful Wizard of Oz" Baums first book. The argumentation goes from an analysis of the various allegories - populist revolt, suffraggette movement, utopia - to a methodologic analysis of the narrative & stylistic structure of the story. For this section I've been reading V. Propp and his analysis of the european fairy tales, trying to identify similarities and differences. Since i work for a Satellite Broadcast - I had acess to lots of information of the on screen development of Baums theme and thus a section of the Thesis will be dedicated to Oz on Radio & TV and on stage. This thesis has been assigned to me by Professor Alessandro Portelli - specialist of Anglo-American literature at the University of Rome. I had suggested the title since I was born in America and wanted to dedicate my studies to an american subject matter. He accepted with enthusiasm but unfortunatelly the University of Rome is unable to provide research material. The subject has turned out to be even more complicated that I thought about at the beginning. Now I would like to arrange an interview with Gore Vidal that lives in Italy - does anyone know if he has an e-mail address? - Thanks again for your help and remember that I'm at your disposal for any information regarding Oz here in Italy - there isn't much - but when my thesis is done I have the intention of giving all my Baum Bugles and Books regarding Oz to the University of Rome, hopeing that a section on America Juvenile Literature will be started. Thanks Again Tina ---------- From: Gili Bar-Hillel Cc: Dave Hardenbrook Subject: books on Oz Date: 22 October 1996 23:23 Tina, The books you are interested in can probably all be ordered through an inter-library loan. Asides from that, I was recently surprised and pleased to discover that "The Wizard of Oz and Who he Was" is available through the online book-order service Amazon Books. I don't know the exact URL, but if you have netscape access it should be very easy to find in a simple search - it's a huge business. Also, I'm sure that I'm speaking for all the subscribers to the Ozzy digest when I say that we would be very interested to hear more about your thesis. Perhaps we could even help - some of the digest subscribers have formidable Ozzy resources and knowledge. To subscribe, simply write a message to Dave Hardenbrook at: DAVE47@delphi.com. Good luck! |\ _,,,---,,_ /,`.-'`' -. ;-;;,_ Gili Bar-Hillel, |,4- ) )-,_..;\ ( `'-' abhillel@fas.harvard.edu '---''(_/--' `-'\_) gili@scso.com (cat by Felix Lee) http://www.scso.com/~gili ====================================================================== Date: Wed, 23 Oct 1996 08:01:46 -0600 (CST) From: Ruth Berman Subject: ozzy digest Gili Bar-Hillel: So this Imogene the Cow isn't the one from Kansas? Yes, I guess that's a cow of a different color. Ozbucket: Yes, the "Third Oz Book" cleared out racist references from the "Queer Visitors" series as well as from the "Wogglebug Book." The characters affected are A. Jackson Lily, a swarthy "Levantine" moneylender ("Levantine," by the way, in this kind of context, means "Jewish," not "Lebanese," and plays on the stereotype of the "greedy Jew") in "Jack Pumpkinhead Pawns the Sawhorse," and the comically cowardly dimwit groundskeeper identified as Black in "How the Adventurers Lost and Found Themselves." I think it's Bad Thing to change a text without acknowledging somewhere in the edition (forward or afterword or footnote or whatever) what changes have been made, but with reasonable acknowledgement so as not to mislead scholars, it's probably a Good Thing to get rid of such racist cracks. Individually, they don't amount to much, but the aggregate of them in a society can do a certain amount of Noticeable Harm, after all. I have a set of copies of the originals, and will try to remember to look up what they say about dates of publication for you. Aaron S. Adelman: Zixi is probably another of the witches who would not be dissolved by water. In "Zixi of Ix" she crosses assorted streams going between Ix and Noland without showing any anxiety, and there don't seem to be bridges over them for hre to use. Rich Morrissey: Baum's "Father Goose" verses are pleasant, but I don't think they're really good enough to hold a general audience (as opposed to the Baum-and-Denslow-fans audience), the way Milne's poems do. ====================================================================== Date: Wed, 23 Oct 1996 10:32:13 +0000 From: lnvf@pop3.iup.edu Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-23-96 Bear: I regularly dress as Oz characters for the Munchkin Conventions, and last year, which was my senior year of high school, I wore my Kaliko costume around school. I do not know what costume I will wear this Halloween. I am considering ordering another round of Buckethead books. Which ones would Digest members recommend? Also, if anyone has a cheap (maximum of $30) copy of _Pirates in Oz_, please inform me. --Nathan M. DeHoff ====================================================================== Date: Wed, 23 Oct 1996 11:51:42 -0400 From: "Melody G. Keller" <104270.2374@compuserve.com> Subject: Ozzy Digest, 10-22-96 Dick Randolph: Thank you, Dick! Now if only that Bugle would come... Melody Grandy ====================================================================== Date: Wed, 23 Oct 1996 13:24:31 -0700 From: ozbot@ix.netcom.com (ozbot) Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest stuff Melting Witches-- So maybe it IS only *Wicked* Witches that are melted by water? I was aware of the fact that Singra was given an enchantment so that water would not affect her, which helped make me wonder about the question I posed about ALL witches' achilles heel being water. Nathan makes an interesting point, though, that maybe Singra's immunity would make even the *magic* of enchanted water not affect her. Well, unless we see her in another story, I guess we may never know. Also-- You probably could make the case that Singra and Shanower's WWofSouth (in his graphic novel ENCHANTED APPLES) are the same person. The setting and the "time" might have to be coordinated in each of the stories, but SIngra was put back to sleep in C-Payes book and (was is Mort? Borg? ah, whoever) found the Witch asleep in the Shonower story. This is all just off the top of my head, of course. Danny ====================================================================== Date: Wed, 23 Oct 1996 15:58:59 +0000 From: rri0189@ibm.net Subject: Re: Evil Empires in Oz? Aaron, why has the word "Empire" been appearing at the end of all your subject lines lately? -- Eleanor Kennedy ====================================================================== Date: Wed, 23 Oct 1996 16:00:45 +0000 From: rri0189@ibm.net Subject: Warning for Digest Members (not really Ozzy) While the subscribers to this digest are more intelligent than the average person, I thought I'd warn all and sundry of an e-mail scam going around. If you get a message saying that someone you've never heard of before will be taking legal action against you for an "unpaid account" unless you call a certain phone number with an 809 area code -- DO NOT CALL IT. The way the scam works is this: 809 is the area code for several Caribbean countries which do not have the same laws regulating telephone service as we have. If you call the number you will get a very long recorded message which will cost you one or two dollars a minute to listen to. The owner of the phone number then splits the profits with the foreign phone company 50-50. This is not a hoax. We received such an e-mail message (no, we didn't call) and then the very next day I read an article in the local paper about how this and other similar scams are going around, and what "the authorities" are doing about it (starting with trying to track down the people at the other end of the phone). If you get one of these messages, just ignore it. Never a "zap" spell around when you need it, that's what I say. -- Eleanor Kennedy ====================================================================== Date: Wed, 23 Oct 1996 17:29:47 -0400 (EDT) From: Gili Bar-Hillel Subject: RE: books on Oz (Dave, I'm leaving it up to you to decide how much of this is appropriate for the digest...) > >My thesis is primarly about "The Wonderful Wizard of Oz" Baums first book. > >The argumentation goes from an analysis of the various allegories - > >populist revolt, suffraggette movement, utopia - to a methodologic analysis > >of the narrative & stylistic structure of the story. I hope you are aware of the highly convincing critiques of the populist parable reading. (So convincing, that I would go as far as to say this reading is simply wrong). Also, the suffragist movement comes out more in "The Land of Oz" - are you treating this book in your thesis too, or finding a similar theme in the first book? For this section I've > >been reading V. Propp and his analysis of the european fairy tales, trying > >to identify similarities and differences. I read that last year and hated it. I appreciate the attempt to find a method to analyse and contrast all stories, but what it amounted to as far as I could discern was reducing these stories to uninteresting, confusing pseudo-mathematical formulas. What about style? What about allegory? What about allusions? All these very important aspects of literature seem to mean nothing to Propp. But as far as plot only, you may be able to use his method to do some kind of statistical analysis of how "The Wizard of Oz" differs from European fairytales? I would think it important to note that "The Wizard of Oz" is not part of an oral tradition, but is a story composed by a single author - and is also novel length, not story length. One comparison that may be interesting to you in light of Propp's work especially is to analyze the changes made to the story of "The Wizard of Oz" by Alexander Volkov, when adapting it for a Russian audience. An Enlish retranslation of Volkov's translation/adaptation of "The Wizard of Oz" was made by Peter Blystone a couple of years ago, published by Red Branch Press. Others on the digest should be able to tell you how to find that book (it's called "Tales of Magic Land, I"). Since i work for a Satellite > >Broadcast - I had acess to lots of information of the on screen development > >of Baums theme and thus a section of the Thesis will be dedicated to Oz on > >Radio & TV and on stage. This all sounds fascinating and wonderful and I hope you are tremendously successful. Do you want more ideas for reference books you could turn to? I hope you don't think I'm being too forward, but these topics are all topics that I've turned in my mind numerous times, I'm just being enthusiastic... > >This thesis has been assigned to me by Professor Alessandro Portelli - > >specialist of Anglo-American literature at the University of Rome. I had > >suggested the title since I was born in America and wanted to dedicate my > >studies to an american subject matter. He accepted with enthusiasm but > >unfortunatelly the University of Rome is unable to provide research > >material. > > > >The subject has turned out to be even more complicated that I thought about > >at the beginning. Now I would like to arrange an interview with Gore Vidal > >that lives in Italy - does anyone know if he has an e-mail address? - > > > >Thanks again for your help and remember that I'm at your disposal for any > >information regarding Oz here in Italy - there isn't much - but when my > >thesis is done I have the intention of giving all my Baum Bugles and Books > >regarding Oz to the University of Rome, hopeing that a section on America > >Juvenile Literature will be started. Again, good luck to you, this all sounds marvellous. I have no idea how to reach Gore Vidal but he is definitely an Oz fan (though I'm not sure he strikes me as particualarly outgoing... not that I know any more about him than you do). I'm thrilled to no longer be the only non-American on the digest! (Though right now I am in America, and there is one subscriber who is currently living in Oslo). Again, good luck, and welcome aboard! |\ _,,,---,,_ /,`.-'`' -. ;-;;,_ Gili Bar-Hillel, |,4- ) )-,_..;\ ( `'-' abhillel@fas.harvard.edu '---''(_/--' `-'\_) gili@scso.com (cat by Felix Lee) http://www.scso.com/~gili ====================================================================== Date: Wed, 23 Oct 1996 22:07:44 -0400 From: Tyler Jones <104707.656@compuserve.com> Subject: Oz Woozy: He is defnitely flesh and he eats. he can go for long periods without sleep, but does perform that activity once in a while. The sense I get from the Oz series is similar to Aaron's view: that only old, dried up wicked witches get destroyed by water. Perhaps Mombi was not dried up enough before her adventures in _Lost King_. Farmer has an interesting explanation in his book, the non-FF-compatible _A Barnstormer in Oz_, but it not worth going into here. Chris: Do you know which newspapers printed the stories? Perhaps you can do some legwork in some Universities microfiche. --Tyler Jones ====================================================================== Date: Wed, 23 Oct 1996 22:20:46 -0400 (EDT) From: Richard Bauman <72172.2631@CompuServe.COM> Subject: Today's Oz Growls Spring is here! At least I received the Spring Bugle today. It made me wonder how they send them? Not alphabetically. Maybe by geographic region and/or by class of membership? I also noticed only a few names I recognized on the title page. I wonder why more of the IWOC aren't involved with our Digest? Of course, I wonder a lot of things. :) By the way, fantasy fans, Patti Perret has finally put out "The Faces of Fantasy." This is a book of pictures of authors with a short comment by each and an intro by Terri Windling on the history of fantasy (Baum is mentioned). It is the same format as her "The Faces of Science Fiction" that came out a number of years ago. In hardback or paperback. William Kotzwinkle, who was just here for a signing of "Bear Went Over The Mountain," initiated my copy. How could I resist a book with a title like that. He even had a bear with him! Rich - TAO OF POOH and THE TE OF PIGLET are by Benjamin Hoff. There is also a WINNIE THE POOH ON PROBLEM SOLVING by R. & S. Allen. I don't consider any of these "begriming" the work of Milne. Will the person who knows please come out of hiding and tell folks how to get to Amazon Books? Gili - I don't know - if those are all of her sources I don't think its going to be much of a thesis. Someone needs to take her in hand and tell her a bit about Oz and guide her to some FAQs and resources. Anyone have time? Regards, Bear (:<) ====================================================================== Date: Thu, 24 Oct 1996 07:10:26 -0800 (PST) From: earlabbe@juno.com (Earl C. Abbe) Subject: Ozzy Digest Submission Moving right along - now have read the Digests through 10/18, but not much other stuff. Tyler Jones comments to David in the 10/16 Digest, I read them all as they came out. (There was a time, decades ago, when I read 3+ books a week; now, 1 a month seems to be too much for me.) The series started with a fascinating premise and went down hill from there. Farmer's series tend to do that. It's probably very good that he did not write any _Barnstormer_ sequels. ====================================================================== Date: Thursday 24-Oct-96 13:32:23 From: Dave Hardenbrook Subject: Ozzy Things WOOZY: I think we're agreed now that the Woozy is flesh-and-blood, though perhaps he has markings on his skin that uncannily resemble wood-grain. I also note that the "Woozy is wood" gaffe is made again by Snow in _Magical Mimics_ when Queen Ra threatens to chop up the Woozy into blocks. (Does anyone else think _Mimics_ is the scariest of the FF?) MOMBI: The potion that Glinda makes Mombi drink at the end of _Land_ must have had 0% water content, or else she would have been "Washed Out" then. As I think someone pointed out once before, in _Lost King_ we never actually SEE Mombi get liquidated, so maybe she's still out there somewhere (maybe Aaron can confirm this)... BILLIE BURKE BASHING ( Forgive us Burke fans, we can't help it! :) ) : Bear wrote: > ...poofy Billy Burke... HAHAHAHA! :) "BUGS" THAT AREN'T WOGGLE: Eleanor Kennedy wrote: >Aaron, why has the word "Empire" been appearing at the end of all >your subject lines lately? I've ascertained that this is the result of a bug in my new program I wrote which expunges all those endless path fields in the headers of E-mail messages. Aaron's "Organization" field is very long and wraps to the next line in my input file, so the program thinks it's not a line to be deleted. I always go through the Digest myself and manually pretty up the Digest beyond what the program can do, but I too thought the word "empire" was part of the subject until you brought it up and then I realized it is a bug. AREN'T YOU ALL PROUD OF ME?: :) I wrote all my remarks for today's Digest, and I DIDN'T MENTION MY BOOK ONCE!!! (Oops, I just did! Hippikaloric!) :) :) :) -- Dave ====================================================================== ] c/ \ /___\ *** THE OZZY DIGEST, OCTOBER 25, 1996 *** |@ @| | V | \\\ |\_/| | ;;; \-/ \ ;/ >< ] ===================================================================== Date: Thu, 24 Oct 1996 18:35:18 -0400 From: "Melody G. Keller" <104270.2374@compuserve.com> Subject: Ozzy Digest, 10-23-96 Finally got the Bugle. What beautiful Wizard of Oz displays in color on the outside & inside covers! The professionals who staged them sure put a lot of loving work into them. Glad the Club could share them with us. Melody Grandy ====================================================================== Date: Thu, 24 Oct 1996 19:14:59 -0500 From: abhillel@husc.harvard.edu (Gili Bar-Hillel) Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-24-96 Bear: the URL for Amazon books is: http://www.amazon.com/. I spent way too much time exploring their site yesterday! Also, I am still corresponding with Tina, and I'm not sure if I should keep this correspondence between us or share it on the digest ... on the one hand, I'm sure that all of you can add a lot of information and ideas, on the other hand, I'm not sure how interesting it would be for all of you to read my bejillionth recycled explanation of why "The Wizard of Oz" ISN'T a parable on populism. Anyway, Tina, you should definitely check out the fine online Ozzy FAQ's maintained by other digesters. :-) ====================================================================== Date: Thu, 24 Oct 1996 19:59:22 -0400 (EDT) From: Richard Bauman <72172.2631@CompuServe.COM> Subject: TODAY'S OZ GROWLS Dave - I'm always glad to hear about your book. Just none of that stuff about Norman or Fred or whoever getting it on with O. :) **************TO BE IGNORED BY YOUNGER DIGESTERS********************* EARL >(There was a time, decades ago, when I read 3+ books a week; now, 1 a month seems to be too much for me.) Would you be willing to share why this is? I only read 5-10 books a month, mostly because I am a magazine addict. Is is going to get worse? At my advanced age, I have begun to look at some books and say to myself "I'm never going to get around to that before I die; don't bother buying it!" If my reading time is going to go downhill further I will be more careful with my priorities. Sadly, Bear (:<) ====================================================================== Date: Thu, 24 Oct 1996 18:04:27 -0700 From: ozbot@ix.netcom.com (ozbot) Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest stuff WISHING HORSE-- Well, among most of the Digesters, this Thompson was rated one of the better ones, and I have to agree. (With my limited exposure to the whole lot of them, of course.) It was nice to see Dorothy center stage again, and Pigasus makes an *okay* character, nothing spectacular, but a good compliment to Dorothy's ambition and optimism. The (g)nomes were characterized right on target! I don't want to give to much plot away if someone hasn't read it, but Thompson puts a nice twist to the convention of "Nomes invading Oz" with Dorothy's reason for going to the NOme King. One thing that REALLY bugged me in the early chapters was Dorothy's characterization. When the plot gets rolling (and a very "grand scale" plot it is-- I liked that!) Dorothy's first reaction is screaming and bursting into tears. Thompson actually calls it crying "hysterically" This is NOT the Dorothy I came to know through Baum, and although Thompson sort of brings Dorothy out of it (I am not finished with the book yet) Well, like I said, it really bugged me. Oh, and very low on the IE (Irrevelant Episode) Scale. THank you, Ruth! Danny ====================================================================== Date: Fri, 25 Oct 1996 02:00:12 +0000 From: Scott Olsen Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-24-96 Am I the only one here who still hasn't received the Spring Bugle? I'm probably driving the mailman crazy. ("There's nothing in that black bag for me....?") Still waiting by the mailbox, I remain, Sincerely, Scott Olsen ====================================================================== Date: Friday 25-Oct-96 03:05:00 From: Dave Hardenbrook Subject: Ozzy Things THE TRUTH ABOUT MY BOOK: Bear wrote: >Dave - I'm always glad to hear about your book. Just none of that stuff about >Norman or Fred or whoever getting it on with O[zma]. :) Folks, see Section 4.5 of my FAQ to see what my second Oz book is REALLY about... BUGLE: Scott Olsen wrote: >Am I the only one here who still hasn't received the Spring Bugle? I still haven't either... -- Dave ====================================================================== ] c/ \ /___\ *** THE OZZY DIGEST, OCTOBER 26, 1996 *** |@ @| | V | \\\ |\_/| | ;;; \-/ \ ;/ >< ] ===================================================================== Date: Fri, 25 Oct 1996 08:11:15 -0400 From: DIXNAM@aol.com Subject: Ozzy Digest 10-25-96 Bear: You read up to 10 books a month??!! And I thought I was doing fine reading one a week!! Danny: Re "Wishing Horse", (and not to nit-pik) I have recently re-read said book, and Thompson's words were that Dorothy was "screaming hysterically about disappearances and white horses . . ." (p.121). All in all, what I perceive as rather normal behavior for a young girl whose close friends have suddenly disappeared. I didn't read that she had "burst into tears", although Thompson uses expressions such as "wailed Dorothy", or "cried Dorothy". Actually, once she realizes she is alone in the knowledge that Ozma, et al, have disappeared, she becomes indignant and begins to plan a course of action, with the help of Pigasus. :-) Dick Randolph ====================================================================== Date: Fri, 25 Oct 1996 08:06:42 -0600 (CST) From: Ruth Berman Subject: ozzy digest Ozbucket: I checked the dates on the "Queer Visitors." You have the 27 titles in order from the "3rd Book" of them Martin Williams edited. He points out in his preface that the series began August 28, 1904, and ended February 26, 1905. That accord with my photocopies (which are from the Chicago "Record Herald"), where the dates run: Aug 28, Sept 4, 11, 18, 25, Oct 2, 9, 16, 23, 30, Nov 6, 13, 20, 27, Dec 4, 11, 18, 25, Jan 1, 8, 15, 22, 29, Feb 5, 13, 19, 26. He had an article on the "Queer Visitors" series in the "Bugle" some years earlier, and he had looked at files from sveral newspapers, and the ones he found that ran the series ran them on these same dates (although some did not run the entire series). Gili: I like your comments to Tina Romano about the problems with the allegorical readings that have been proposed of "Wizard" and about the difficulties of applying Propp to non-folklore stories. (It can be done -- Jack Zipes in his collection of French fairy tales made some interesting use of Propp in discussing the authors of literary fairy tales in France. But those again are mostly short stories, and fit into that kind of analysis better than novels do.) Tina Romano: Something you might want to bring into your dissertation is the Italian fairy tale tradition. I know there were translations into Italian of both "Wizard" and "Land." Perhaps some discussion of how these were received by Italian audiences, and in what ways they are like and unlike Italian fairy tales? ("Pinocchio," the stories of Italo Calvino, maybe the folklore fairy tales you probably know from the sources Calvino used, although I only know them from Calvino's retellings, etc.) Melody Grandy: My copy of the "Bugle" arrived recently, too. I enjoyed reading Phyllis Karr's review of your book, and decided I'd better order myself a copy, which I've done. Yes, the Dayton's "Wizard" display photos made a gorgeous set of covers, didn't they! (David Hulan and the others who reported receiving it a couple of weeks earlier than we did obviously have "first class mail" memberships. For those of us who have "bulk mail" memberships, the delivery times can be a good deal more scattered, as the PO lets bulk stuff wait if they have too much 1st class category to handle. Scott Olsen -- if your copy hasn't already arrived, you should probably give it a couple of weeks, but then if it doesn't show up, write the "Bugle" to ask what gives. It might be a glitch in the labels, or it might even be lost in transit.) ====================================================================== Date: Fri, 25 Oct 1996 10:29:24 -0400 (EDT) From: Gili Bar-Hillel Subject: Books whose keywords include "oz" (fwd) For those of you who haven't yet found Amazon books, here's some info they just sent me this morning. These are NEW books, they have a much longer list of books that are already in stock and on hand. Many of them are sold at discounted prices, but you have to pay for shipping too ($3 per order plus about $.95 per book) Gili ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Hi, as per your request, we at Amazon.com Books are notifying you of new books matching the following criteria: keywords include "oz" The new books are listed at the end of this message. If you're interested in any of these books you can order them online at http://www.amazon.com/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------ "The Wizard of Oz" by L. Frank Baum, Lisbeth Zwerger(Illustrator) List: $19.95 -- Amazon.com Price: $17.96 -- You Save: $1.99 (10%) Subject: Fantasy Publisher: North South Books Binding: Hardcover Expected publication date: October 1, 1996 ISBN: 1558586385 URL: http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ISBN=1558586385 ------------------------------------------------------------------------ "The Lion of Oz & the Badge of Courage" by Roger S. Baum List: $21.95 -- Amazon.com Price: $19.76 -- You Save: $2.19 (10%) Publisher: Yellow Brick Road Pub Binding: Hardcover Expected publication date: October 1996 ISBN: 096301014X URL: http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ISBN=096301014X ------------------------------------------------------------------------ "The Munchkins of Oz" by Stephen Cox List: $18.95 -- Amazon.com Price: $17.06 -- You Save: $1.89 (10%) Subjects: Motion picture actors and actr, United States, Biography, Midgets in motion pictures, Wizard of Oz (Motion picture), Motion Picture Acting Publisher: Cumberland House Binding: Paperback Expected publication date: October 1, 1996 ISBN: 1888952040 URL: http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ISBN=1888952040 ------------------------------------------------------------------------ "Ozoplaning With the Wizard of Oz" by Ruth Thompson List: $12.95 -- Amazon.com Price: $12.95 Publisher: Books of Wonder Binding: Paperback Expected publication date: October 1996 ISBN: 0929605578 URL: http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ISBN=0929605578 ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- ====================================================================== Date: Fri, 25 Oct 1996 13:25:45 -0400 (EDT) From: "Aaron S. Adelman" Subject: The Antipolitical Ozite Empire 1) Ruth, OK, so I forgot about that incident with Zixi and the rivers. Does anyone out there have a reference to Glinda coming in contact with water? 2) Eleanor, in extension of what Dave said, the organization in my header is The Benevolent Monarchy of the Antipolitical Martian Empire, which is a government I jokingly founded with myself as king about a month ago. 3) Dave, in _The Woozy of Oz_, Barry and I have left it fuzzy whether Mombi has actually been dead or just in hiding. As the Woozy was in a different part of the Emerald City at the time munching on a gumdrop bush, he can't say firsthand what happened. When I arranged for him to allow me to speak to Mombi herself, upon being asked whether she had actually been killed or not, she launched into a lengthy speech upon "Glinda's negative impact upon the judicial system of Oz" which lasted for three hours before my wireless rerouter, not being able to stand the strain of so much venom, started pouring out smoke. Not wishing to risk a second hefty repair bill for the only piece of hardware that allows me access to the Lurline's Worlder Internet, I have not further researched the question. 4) On Wednesday, being my birthday, I went down to BOW and bought three books: _The Glass Cat of Oz_, _The Giant Garden of Oz_, and _The Wonder City of Oz_. My preliminary comments: _The Glass Cat of Oz_: I like it! The Lord High Qui-Questioner: How can this be? You don't like anything! So sue me for being picky on the Mebesian heresies. I found especially good the limitations placed on the word of transformation and the strategy used by Becky and Barry used to make sure they would be able to continue using it. Congratulations, David. _The Giant Garden of Oz_: Actually rather Laumerian. Extremely scary. Shannower probably wins the prize for strangest antagonists and cruelty to Dorothy and several other characters. It is amazing what a cow can do these days. _The Wonder City of Oz_: Doesn't seem as bad as the last time I read it (probably due to reading some of the Mebesian heresies recently), but the dialog is still terrible. In some places Neill seems to be trying to outthompson Thompson's punniness. The question hour scene still makes no sense. Have been making faces since I started rereading it. Also: I suspect that What, who Number Nine's father used to know, may be the same person mentioned in the Abbott and Costello routine "Who's on First?", as the name is extremely unusual. The only other person I can remember being called What, Cousin It's son, is probably a different person; I can't remember ever reading about anything that looked like him in Oz. Aaron Solomon (ben Saul Joseph) Adelman adelman@yu1.yu.edu ====================================================================== Date: Fri, 25 Oct 1996 14:00:57 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Olderman Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-25-96 Bear: Not all of us "old folks" have dropped our reading habit or seen it diminish. I read at least 4-5 books/month, mostly just before bed (about a 45 min. read, then I start nodding off), or on Sunday morning. I'm 52. Does that give you hope? Danny, etc.: Gloma, the witch in WISHING HORSE, feared water, I think. She was not a bad witch. --Robin ====================================================================== Date: Fri, 25 Oct 1996 17:09:37 -0700 From: "MALCOLM D. BARKER" Subject: Oz Film buffs: Was again at Tower Video yesterday and saw "The Wizard of Oz" in THX enhanced audio and video is now #7 in videodisc sales, right up there with "Twister". Can anyone verify if it's actually a better version than my 50th Anniversary Limited Edition disc? Could it possibly be finer quality than the Criterion disc version?? Welcome Tina! Good luck, I've had hard time finding oz books in bookstores here in the US. I know there are some extra fine hardbound versions of the FF, but at this point I'm mainly interested in reading the adventures and would be happy to buy any used paperbacks, etc. of the books beyond the first 14 of the FF, anyone. Yes, I felt Baum made it clear the Woozy was not only a blockhead but meat, too. SWinkies: Sorry to have missed, especially as I was a Dana Pt resident for many years. I think I was reading about the Munchkin Con where there were tickets available at the door for few dollars more and must have spaced on it (oops) I must be sure to order in advance next year! Really want to get to meet Dave and all the rest! Malcolm ====================================================================== Date: Sat, 26 Oct 1996 02:51:49 -0400 From: Tyler Jones <104707.656@compuserve.com> Subject: Oz Nathan: You can persue my web page to check out available Buckethead books that you do not have as well as some reviews of them. Some of the better ones that I would recommend are _Crocheted Cat_, _Colorful Kitten_, _Dinamonster_, _Flying Bus_, _Lunarr and Maureen_, _Disenchatned Princess_, _Red Reera the Yookoohoo_ and _Haunted Castle_. _Disenchanted Princess_ is quite expensive, but is absolutely worth every single penny. Eleanor: Thanks for the scam tip, although lately the closest thing I have been receiving lately are e-mail messages telling me of kinds of great investment opportunities. All I have to do is either send them a bunch of money or sign up for their seminar... Danny: I know what you mean. While _Wishing Horse_ is a great one of the FF, RPT does have an annoying habit of making her female characters wishy-washy and rather spineless, as they wait for the big he-men to come in and save the day, except for when Ozma uses the magic belt, of course. --Tyler "Two Days" Jones ====================================================================== Date: Sat, 26 Oct 1996 13:42:11 -0400 From: "Melody G. Keller" <104270.2374@compuserve.com> Subject: Ozzy Digest, 10-25-96 Dave & Scott: They're probably mailing out the Bugles 10 at a time.... Melody Grandy ====================================================================== ] c/ \ /___\ *** THE OZZY DIGEST, OCTOBER 28, 1996 *** |@ @| | V | \\\ |\_/| | ;;; \-/ \ ;/ >< ] (NOTE: There was no Digest for 10/27, so no one missed anything. -- Dave) ===================================================================== Date: Sat, 26 Oct 1996 17:19:06 +0000 From: lnvf@pop3.iup.edu Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-26-96 Aaron: Glinda comes into contact with water in _Scalawagons_. She and many other Ozites attend a swimming party. Robin: We are never told that Gloma fears water. When Dorothy explains that she melted the Wicked Witch of the West with a bucket of water, Pigasus suggests that they try the same technique to Gloma. Dorothy and Pigasus do not find any water, and are unable to even attempt to dissolve Gloma. If she did fear water, however, it is unlikely that she would have the Black River so near her castle. Tyler: I already have a copy of _Disenchanted Princess_, and agree that it is worth its price. Thank you for the other suggestions. Nathan M. DeHoff ====================================================================== Date: Sat, 26 Oct 1996 20:01:06 -0400 (EDT) From: Richard Bauman <72172.2631@CompuServe.COM> Subject: Today's Oz Growls Dick - I cheat and stay up late at night. I mean until 1-1:30 am. That really adds to the old reading time. I'm bogged down right now as I am reading Jordan's new book, which is 700 pages. But well worth the effort. It's interfering with my finishing Gnome King. If you really want to be impressed, ask David how much he reads. He's in another league! Robin - I'm 60, so your 52 doesn't give me hope. I am still thinking enviously of you sequestering yourself once a year and reading the whole LOTR. I'm still not quite sure how you manage that? Malcolm - Could you share where you live? I am amazed you can't find a used bookstore or a Barnes & Noble with Oz books. With a location, other Digesters can lead you to the light. Weekend regards, Bear (:<) ====================================================================== Date: Sun, 27 Oct 1996 10:29:42 -0500 From: RMorris306@aol.com Subject: Oz Writers et al Hi again! I'm catching up on some Digest comments I missed... Now that I think of it, I've forgotten (or maybe purged from my memory) one of the most bizarre of the semi-pornographic twists, not only on Oz, but on several of the other classic children's fantasies. It was a comic book called LOST GIRLS, and I confess that, despite passing up all the other "adult" Oz comics like OZ SQUAD, I was weak enough to buy *one* issue of it. It was probably because of the writer, Alan Moore, who was one of the most imaginative talents in the comics field in the '80s (especially memorable for his DC series SWAMP THING and WATCHMEN). But it's easy to forget how quickly imagination lags in the comics: Stan Lee was one of the top writers in imagination and flair at one time, too, but you wouldn't know it from the AMAZING SPIDER-MAN comic strip he writes today. In any case, LOST GIRLS had a connection, not only with Oz, but also with Wonderland and Neverland. It dealt with the erotic adventures of Alice Liddell, Wendy Darling, and Dorothy Gale (after they'd grown up, circa 1920... like Philip Jose Farmer, Moore apparently didn't go along with Dorothy's eventually moving to Oz permanently). Thankfully, Pooh's Forest escaped. (Christopher Milne was still a young child at the time...besides which, he was still alive when LOST GIRLS was published, and might well have initiated a lawsuit.) Someone else made a comment I never got around to responding to before...to the effect that most Oz fans seem to like Baum best for the same reason most Star Trek fans seem to like the original series best: a preference for the original. Well, I'll admit I *do* like Baum best, but my affection for the various ST series is about the same. (I like VOYAGER a little less than the other three, but I expect it to improve as it ages, as the other two more recent series, especially NEXT GENERATION, did.) I'll admit to a special fondness for the original series, but I suspect that's more a baby-boomer "thing..." most of my generation grew up with the original series, and were already adults when the later series appeared. Indeed, I've met some people...especially twentysomethings who were still quite young when NEXT GEN was on...who prefer *that* series and consider the special effects of the '60's series hopelessly dated. In other fields, preferences don't always go by originators. If anything, I'm more inclined in that direction than most people in comic fandom...I've had no end of people explain to me in great detail why they think John Byrne wrote better Superman stories than Jerry Siegel, or why Frank Miller wrote and drew better Batman stories than Bill Finger and Bob Kane. (Needless to say, I disagree on both counts.) Even in the case of the STAR TREK shows, Gene Roddenberry didn't write most of any of the series, even the original...like most TV shows, they were collaborative efforts from the beginning. On the whole, it's very rare for someone besides the originator of a character or series to improve on it. Which isn't to say it hasn't occasionally happened: I don't think anyone would deny that Shakespeare wrote a better HAMLET than Thomas Kyd and a better OTHELLO than Boccacio. But the genius of a Shakespeare is extremely rare, and I don't think any Oz writer has had anything approaching it. So...why let anyone else write the series at all? It wasn't a choice between Oz books by Baum and Oz books by Thompson, but between more Oz books than already existed, once Baum was dead, and no more Oz books. I'm not such a Baum purist as to say that Thompson never once improved on Baum's weaker books, or even to deny that some of her best come very close to Baum at his peak. But I don't think she ever could have *created* Oz on her own...and that, ultimately, is what distinguishes Baum from all other past and future Oz writers. For that matter, judging by the recent comments in the Digest, even Baum books these days don't seem to be pure Baum any more! I'd been thinking of getting THE THIRD BOOK OF OZ, but now I don't think I'll bother...if the QUEER VISITORS stories are revised to reflect modern sensibilities, what's to distinguish them from THE VISITORS FROM OZ? And I already *have* THE WOGGLE-BUG BOOK, though not in the original. My copy (acquired from the estate of the late DC Comics writer/ editor E. Nelson Bridwell; where *he* got it I don't know) was published by an outfit called Scholars' Facsimiles and Reprints out of Delmar, NY, and has an introduction by Douglas C. Greene, apologizing for some of the Politically Incorrect material in the text itself. I'm pretty sure the text hasn't been censored; it looks like a photostat from the original edition, and is full of Jewish, Irish, black and Chinese stereotypes and dialect. (And, I must confess, it's also very funny at times.) Would I give this to a contemporary child, at least without a detailed explanation? Of course not. But, if reprinted, should it be reprinted the way Baum wrote it? I think so...to do otherwise is on a par with the efforts to bowdlerize HUCKLEBERRY FINN. Rich Morrissey ====================================================================== Date: Sun, 27 Oct 1996 11:53:39 -0800 (PST) From: Eric Gjovaag Subject: I need some help with "Oziana" Has anybody gotten the extra page for this year's "Oziana" yet? I bought mine at Winkies and not through the mail, so I'm not on the list to be automatically sent one. I wrote to the publishers some time ago requesting one, but I haven't received it, and the people I've asked privately don't have one. So, if it's been sent out, would some kind soul be willing to make a copy for me? Thanks. E-mail me privately to make arrangements. --Eric Gjovaag ### Visit my "Wizard of Oz" web site! http://www.eskimo.com/~tiktok/ ### ====================================================================== Date: Sun, 27 Oct 1996 20:40:45 -0500 From: JOdel@aol.com Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-26-96 On witchy-washiness; A MOPPeT which occurs to me is that witchiness is a genetic glitch which shows up in the normal population much like albinism, and at about the same frequency. This particular glitch appears to require two X chromosones, consequently the absence of male witches in the Oz universe. (All other forms of male magic users seem to exist, but not male witches.) Only witches appear to be subject to melting when inundated. We do not reallly know whether this is due to something related to their genetic makeup from birth, or whether it is a condition which results from the way the use of magic affects people with this genetic trait. It is possible that this sensitivity may be a side effect of the use of certain types of magic by a genetic witch, rather in the way an albino's genetic sensitivity to light can cause progressivly worsening vision problems. My own take on the possibility is to suspect that it may be a side effect of the age retarding spells used by nearly all magic users (witches and otherwise) during the pre-Ozman period, before aging became optional to the general populace. (Note that most witches must have used these spells sparingly, since, with the exception of Gloma, they seem to have all presented the appearance of hags, I doubt that this was due to some perverse choice on their part.) If this is so, future Ozian witches will have no need of such spells, and thus not develop the extreme sensitivity to water unaviodable in a pre-Ozman era witch. It should be noted that a witch may be able to handle wet objects, with caution, so long as she is not exposed to large amounts of water directly. And there is some question as to whether there may be some additional component which we do not know about. The WWW was melted by a bucket of dirty wash water so far as I can recall. We are not clued in to whether Mombi's execution entailed any particular preparations in the materials used. There may also be a difference as to whether the water must be standing water, water from a container, running water or some other sort. ====================================================================== Date: Sat, 26 Oct 1996 17:32:40 -0400 From: DennisLiv@aol.com Subject: Journey to the West Myths, fairy tales & Oz: Perhaps another take on this discussion by many over the past few weeks relates to the literary structure itself of the original "Wizard." I've been thinking about this since seeing a performance last night of "Journey to the West," a presentation at Boston's Huntington Theater (Gili: go see), which will next move on to the Berkeley Rep in California. The show has serious dramatic problems, though terrific stagecraft. That aside, what makes it fascinating to any Oz fan is a certain family resemblance between Baum & this ancient Chinese tale (based on a true story, as the movies say) of a monk who travels from China to India to obtain sacred Buddhist scrolls. In fact, a review of the show in the Boston Globe explicitly recognizes the link (as does PR for the show itself, which is along the lines of "If you like Oz ..."). Here are the opening paragraphs of the Globe review by Ed Siegel: "We're off to get the scriptures, the wonderful scriptures of Buddha...No offense, we're just trying to capture the spirit of 'Journey to the West'...and your best bet at finding enjoyment in the production is to think of it as a 1592 Eastern version of 'The Wizard of Oz.' Instead of Dorothy we have the monk Tripitaka, the Scripture Pilgrim based on a historical & mythical Chinese monk, Hsuan-tang, who trekked from China to India in the 7th century. Instead of being helped by the Lion, Scarecrow and Tin Man, Tripitaka is aided by the Monkey, Pig and river spirit...Dorothy wanted a way back home, Tripitaka wants to travel toward enlightenment. The foursome is beset by any number of wicked witches in the form of Dragon Kings, evil spirits and assorted other baddies." (end of excerpt) the Boddhisatva of Compassion who drops in & out of the story to help the characters focus on their goal. Moreover, Monkey, Pig & river spirit are traveling with the Pilgrim, in part, to work up brownie points that will bring them spiritual rewards at the end. And when the goal is fulfilled, the Pilgrim is magically carried home in an instant... (No, he doesn't click his heels.) The point, of course, is not that Baum was somehow aware of this story, but that the form his novel takes - a hero(ine) with three helpers/acolytes traveling a great distance to fulfill a preordained quest, against great odds - evidently goes back a long way. Baum's achievement was to Americanize this ancient archetype. (Although a Buddhist interpretation of Wizard, come to think of it, would be most interesting indeed.) The show "Journey to the West," by the way, is adapted from a new English translation of the original (Hsi Yu Chi) by Anthony Yu. ====================================================================== Date: Sun, 27 Oct 1996 00:01:35 -0400 (EDT) From: "Aaron S. Adelman" Subject: Aunt Em and Uncle Henry Just out of curiousity, has anyone (besides Laumer, who wrote _Aunt Em and Uncle Henry in Oz_) written a story in which Aunt Em and Uncle Henry get there own adventure? _The Emerald City of Oz_ doesn't quite fit what I have in mind; I'm thinking more in terms of them being the main protagonists. Aaron Solomon (ben Saul Joseph) Adelman adelman@yu1.yu.edu ====================================================================== ] c/ \ /___\ *** THE OZZY DIGEST, OCTOBER 29, 1996 *** |@ @| | V | \\\ |\_/| | ;;; \-/ \ ;/ >< ] ===================================================================== Date: Mon, 28 Oct 1996 15:30:00 +0100 (MET) From: "Romano, Tina" Subject: RE: Ozzy Digest, 10-28-96 - Witches & Water Hi Dave, I'ts great to be reading about all what's going on around Oz! I'm learning so much and I'm really looking forward to come up with a MOPPeT of my own. I wish to ask a couple of questions: Does any of the digesters know about an article intitled: "On the Liquidation of Witches by Douglas A. Rossman - Baum Bugle Spring 1969. I tried to order it thru the Bugle but it looks like it's out of print. I have a list of approx. 50 titles taken from various magazines & local newspapers concerning various criticism on Oz . Can I send the file to you? Perhaps some digest readers have them. Does anybody have something to say about David Lynch's" Wild at Heart" and "Blue Velvet" in Connection with Oz? Grazie! Tina ====================================================================== Date: Mon, 28 Oct 1996 08:48:29 -0500 (EST) From: Gili Bar-Hillel Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-28-96 Joyce (Jodel) - I like your witchy theory, it works for me! My personal theory is that Glinda's sorcery is a different talent than witchery. Anwyay, she still looks young, and I believe that if she were also sensitive to water we would have heard of this much earlier than "Scalawagons", in "Glinda of Oz" - the last place Glinda would like to be would be under a lake... Aaron - I would say that "The Giant Garden of Oz" tells more of the story of Em and Henry than we have heard for a long time. But they are mostly passive in their adventures here, the active protagonist is again Dorothy. Dennis - thanks for the recommendation. Actually, I saw a preview of "Journey to the West" last Sunday with my 20th cent. American Theatre class. I enjoyed it very much, and I was sort of thinking to myself: "hey, this is a bit like a cross between Peter Brook's "Mahabarata" and "The Wizard of Oz""... But I didn't really want to say anything to the other students, because I see "The Wizard of Oz" everywhere, and in this class I've found "Wizard of Oz" references everywhere from "Angels in America" to "Death of a Salesman" (hey, maybe there's a paper topic somewhere in here...). But then, on Thursday the director of the show, Mary Zimmerman, came to our class and actually opened with: "think of this play as an ancient Chinese "Wizard of Oz'", and all of the sudden I discovered that I wasn't the only one who had tried to match up characters in both stories, and then the Boston Globe came out with that title: "East Meets Oz", and I felt very gratified... "Journey to the West" primiered in Chicago and will be shown in Los-Angeles. |\ _,,,---,,_ /,`.-'`' -. ;-;;,_ Gili Bar-Hillel, |,4- ) )-,_..;\ ( `'-' abhillel@fas.harvard.edu '---''(_/--' `-'\_) gili@scso.com (cat by Felix Lee) http://www.scso.com/~gili ====================================================================== Date: Mon, 28 Oct 1996 10:37:16 -0600 (CST) From: steller@mail.pittstate.edu (Stephen J. Teller) Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-28-96 You have not heard from me for awhile because my computer has lost its internet resources (temporarily I hope) thanks to my having had multimedia installed (they both want the same interrupt #5--whatever that means). There are several things in the last two digests that I would like to reply to. Has anyone actually read Roger Baum's THE LION OF OZ . . . ? I had heard that was coming out for months and now it is listed as being newly published. IN answer to Rich Morrissey's wondering whether THE THIRD BOOK OF OZ should be acquired since he already has THE VISITERS FROM OZ. The stories in VISITORS were cmpletely re-written. The versions in THIRD BOOK are mostly complete, with some unacknowledged expurgations. I would recommend getting THIRD BOOK as you will then have 98% of what Baum wrote, and the material is just not available anywhere else. What I would really like to see is IWOC publish the entire run of the originals in color (perhaps with the Denslow SCARECROW AND TIN WOODMAN pieces also. However, the cost of that would be almost prohibitive. But it is one of the most important things the club could do. "Ipse dixit." DennisLiv: I wish I could see JOURNEY TO THE WEST. I have taught excerpts from it in World Literature classes. The complete work comes in four large volumes. I do have a videotape of a version of it, but it is in Chinese with Chinese subtitles. To say it is based on history is a bit of a stretch, 95% or more of it is pure (and wondrous) fiction. Steve T. ====================================================================== Date: Mon, 28 Oct 1996 13:26:03 -0500 From: DavidXOE@aol.com Subject: Ozzy Digests since 10/21 Back from vacation with a lot of Digests to read and respond to! I'll try to keep from running on -too- long. 10/21: Dick: I saw the Zwerger WIZARD last weekend at some bookstore in Cincinnati, but after looking at the pictures I decided that it wasn't anything I needed in my collection. (I'm mostly a text fan, though I sometimes buy something with pictures that really appeal to me. These didn't.) Nathan: The pre-SKY ISLAND Oz book that I include among my favorites is OZMA. (My list of Baum's best books also includes ZIXI, PATCHWORK GIRL, RINKITINK, and LOST PRINCESS, FWIW.) Rich: I don't think Dorothy's destruction of the Wicked Witches turned Oz into an unEarthly paradise. Oz was a much better place after Dorothy's first visit, but Mombi was still at large, and there was obviously enough general discontent for Jinjur to have been able to recruit her army of revolt. It was only after Ozma's accession at the end of LAND that Oz became something of a Utopia, and even after that there were large parts of Oz that knew little or nothing of Ozma's rule and were far from utopian. (This is more prominent in Thompson, of course, but even Baum had the Hopper-Horner conflicts, Jinxland, the central Winkie country of LOST PRINCESS, and the wild Gillikin country of his last three books.) Melody: Sure, I'd believe your father's name is David. It's a fine and honorable name. :-) Dave: $30 is a bit high for "The Oz-Wonderland War", but I wouldn't have had buyer's remorse if I'd spent it. I paid $20 for mine and considered I easily got my money's worth. 10/23: Nathan: It's not really clear in GLINDA whether Coo-ee-oh turned into a swan before or after she hit the water; if before, it wouldn't really prove whether she'd have melted or not if she'd just fallen in. But it seems unlikely that water would have melted her; if it would, then why didn't the Su-dic just toss a pail of water at her? And Glinda, though referred to as a Good Witch in WIZARD, doesn't seem to have been at all the same kind of witch as the others. My guess is that Glinda, Zixi, and Gloma, who all appear young and beautiful, are also not susceptible to water. (Even Mombi, in her simulacrum-form in LUCKY BUCKY, was soaked in water and unharmed.) That might have been a particular weakness of the WWW, possibly shared with a few other witches. Rich: WINNIE-THE-POOH has probably not been perverted as yet because it's still under copyright, and anybody who did would get his buns sued off by Disney, who currently owns the US copyrights. The other children's classics that -have- been perverted are all in public domain. Tyler: QUEEN ZIXI is one of my favorite Baums as well, but I'd rate it just below SKY ISLAND and LOST PRINCESS. (FWIW, I read both ZIXI and SKY ISLAND for the first time as an adult. The only ones of Baum's non-Oz books I read as a child were MMMO, SANTA CLAUS, and SEA FAIRIES.) Have you asked Peter Glassman directly about posting reviews of BoW books on your Web page, or are you waiting for him to respond to things you've said in the Digest? There are theoretical limits to how fast computers can work, based on the speed of light, but we're nowhere near that limit as yet. We're getting fairly close to the limit of what can be put into a case that can be carried by one person, though. (When I say "fairly close" I mean within a couple of orders of magnitude - which, when you consider that computer power for a desktop has been going up an order of magnitude every couple of years for a couple of decades, means that we're probably not going to see power increase as fast as it has been by the time we get to the next century.) 10/24: Earl: What happened to cut your reading rate down from 3+ books a week to one a month? I used to read 3+ books a week, too, but then I retired and now I'm up to 4-5 a week, unless I read a number of children's books in a row (as I did recently), in which case I might get up to 8-10. (In other words, to reassure some people who seemed worried about it, getting older - at least, up to 60 - doesn't do much to slow one down by itself, though vision problems might.) Dave: I'd rate it a toss-up between OJO and MIMICS as the scariest of the FF, though there's more comic relief in OJO. 10/26: Aaron: Glad you liked GLASS CAT. I remember when Bear read it he commented to me that you could tell an engineer wrote it because of all the practical problem-solving that went on... So Number Nine's father's friend was a second baseman, eh? Malcolm: If you're a member of the IWOC you can order the Del Rey editions of the first several Thompson books from them for a pretty reasonable price. And there are PB editions of quite a few of the later books from BoW and/or the IWOC that are in the $10 or so range. Used PBs, however, are probably pretty hard to find. It may be that you had to buy your membership in advance to eat lunch at the SWinkie convention, but I'd be very surprised if they'd have turned you away if you'd shown up at the door and asked to watch (or even participate in) the program and socializing. Oz fans are hospitable, like Ozites. (In fact, there's always been more food that was eaten at the SWinkies I've been to; if you'd been willing to wait till everyone with memberships had eaten, you could probably have had food as well.) 10/28: Bear: I don't consider my reading rate all that spectacular, but that may be influenced by the fact that my wife reads more than a book a day while working full time; she gets way ahead of me and my life sometimes seems like a constant struggle to get through the to-be-read shelves while keeping her supplied with books. (I think I need to start checking books that she's interested in and I'm not out of the library for her, or something like that.) Guess that's enough for this round. I don't expect to be away from home again this year, so I should be able to keep up for the next while. David Hulan ====================================================================== Date: Mon, 28 Oct 1996 13:14:12 -0600 (CST) From: Ruth Berman Subject: ozzy digest Aaron S. Adelman: Glinda probably comes in contact with water in "Glinda," when she and the Wizard are trying to get to Ozma and Dorothy in Coo-ee-oh's sunken palace, although I forget if the text says explicitly that she touches water. Joyce O'Dell: (continuing the witch topic) It may be overly systematic to say that there aren't any male witches in Oz. The term "witch" is so strongly associated with "woman" that (whatever a particular author may mean by the term "witch") it's possible that some of the male magic-workers using such titles as Magician, Conjuror, Wizard, etc., could as well be considered "witches." Your suggestion that sensitivity to water is a side effect of using age-retarding spells is attractive, but Baum's depiction of witches between books seems too inconsistent to allow it. Zixi, the only witch specifically mentioned as using spells to make herself appear young, doesn't seem to be vulnerable to water. The suggestion made by some of the others, that magical wickedness withers the body gradually over time and leaves the "witch" (presumably, any wicked magic-worker?) vulnerable to being melted would probably cover all the mortal-born cases? R. Morris: Seems to me you're leaving out two middle cases in setting up the alternatives of having "Woggle-Bug Book" complete with racist jokes, which you would hesitate to give to a child, and not wanting to have it at all if the racist jokes have been cut. One middle case is that you might want to let a child read it (without taking time out for long "do as I say, not as Baum says" explanations). In that case, the "Third Book" edition would do better than the facsimile. The other middle case is that an edition might cut out the racist jokes, and include an acknowledgement somewhere that such editing had been done, so that for scholarly purposes you would know to ask for a look at the original version. The comparison to Twain's "Huck Finn" is misleading, because Twain's use of racist terms is not in the service of racism but is partly an accurate depiction of the speech of the characters and (mostly) an attack on racism. Baum's use of racist terms is just plain racist -- in a mild way, and not consciously intended as such, but it is. (My own preference, obviously, is for cutting out cute little racist jokes and acknowledging the cuts in an endnote. But reprints of children's books probably do, after all, have to consider the possibility of a large number of children among the readers, and I think it's exaggerated to complain that the "3rd Book" edition isn't worth having if it doesn't have the reference to Wash, the dimwitted groundskeeper, as a Negro, and doesn't keep in his line of dialogue in lawdy-massa dialect, and doesn't describe the moneylender as "chocolate-colored" and "Levantine," in the Visitors part; and doesn't refer to the dimwitted washlady as a Negro, in the "Wogglebug" part. The racist implications of the Irish, Swedish, and Chinese jokes are much slighter, and I don't recall if the "3rd Book" bothers to make any changes in them.) ====================================================================== Date: Mon, 28 Oct 1996 13:50:44 -0500 (EST) From: MICHAEL TURNIANSKY Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-26-96 Dick Randolph exclaims: > > Bear: You read up to 10 books a month??!! And I thought I was doing fine > reading one a week!! Ah, back in my heyday of college, there was one summer (having no TV, no job, and no classes, so nothing better to do), that I read an average of 13 books/week! Nowadays, I'm lucky to read a book every other month or so (and I still have 18 months of back periodicals to catch up on. Let's see, only 30 years until retirement....) --Mike "Shaggy Man" Turniansky ====================================================================== Date: Mon, 28 Oct 1996 13:33:02 -0600 (CST) From: Robin Olderman Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 10-28-96 As Pete said, if anyone lacks the missing page of OZIANA, mail the printer in Escanabe. Johnston's Printers 711 Ludington Escanaba, MI ====================================================================== Date: Mon, 28 Oct 1996 20:46:03 -0500 (EST) From: Richard Bauman <72172.2631@CompuServe.COM> Subject: Today's Oz Growls Eric - Would anyone who has the missing Oziana page be willing to send it to the Digest? That would take care of a whole bunch of us. JOdel@aol.com - I think vampires also have some trouble with water as well as sunlight. Dennis >The point, of course, is not that Baum was somehow aware of this story, but that the form his novel takes - a hero(ine) with three helpers/acolytes traveling a great distance to fulfill a preordained quest, against great odds - evidently goes back a long way. How about "The Iliad and The Odyssey?" Regards, Bear (:<) ====================================================================== Date: Mon, 28 Oct 1996 23:32:04 -0500 (EST) From: "Aaron S. Adelman" Subject: There are warlocks in Oz Empire 1) Jodel, Barry and I have introduced a few warlocks in Lurline's Machine. However I can't say much about them here because information on the Green Warlock is meagre, Barry the Asmard of Ix would rather lay low for a while, and anything I could tell you on Prasmthrasm you probably wouldn't believe anyway. 2) Dennis, the story of "Journey to the West" seems to have been incorporated in modified form into _The Enchanter Reborn_ (of "Sir Harold and the Gnome King" fame). I suppose Shea and Chalmers in the Enchanter version correspond with Pastoria II and Tracy Tryffle. (: Aaron Solomon (ben Saul Joseph) Adelman adelman@yu1.yu.edu ====================================================================== Date: Mon, 28 Oct 1996 22:47:02 -0600 From: International Wizard of Oz Club Subject: RE: OZ related clip art Cc: 'Dave Hardenbrook' Offhand, we don't have this info. I'm forwarding your request to the Ozzy Digest mailing list in hopes that the subscribers can help. Sincerely, Jim Vander Noot ---------- From: BUCH0@aol.com Sent: Thursday, October 24, 1996 3:51 PM Subject: OZ related clip art Is there a source on the net where I can access OZ related clip art or subscribe to such? I am involved in a high school theme party which will be about OZ, the Emrald City, the characters etc. I need some art to create signs etc. Any ideas? Your assistance is appreciated signed -- "Lost in OZ" ====================================================================== Date: Tue, 29 Oct 1996 00:34:32 -0500 From: Tyler Jones <104707.656@compuserve.com> Subject: Oz Bear: Obviously, you must have bought _Crown of Swords_ in its hardback form. In a futile attempt to save space, I buy only paperbacks. This will require me to wait another 7 months or so to read it, but I will suffer nobly. Rich: Despite Thompson being my favorite Ozzy author (IE's and one-more-attempt- to-conquer-Oz notwithstanding), I agree with your belief that only Baum could have created Oz in the special way that he did. JOdel: Interesting theories. I found your MOppet(s) fascinating. Aaron: Although I cudgeled my mighty brain for all it was worth (ahem), I do not recall Em and Henry getting much press outside the FF. After their tour de Oz in _Emerald City_, the faded into the background. Baum ocasionally gave them a mention, Thompson ignored them, and Neill gave them a little bit of airtime, but that is it. For the most part, these two kindly souls are rarely heard from, and then only in soundbites. --Tyler Jones ====================================================================== Date: Tue, 29 Oct 1996 12:45:00 -0800 From: Dave Hardenbrook Subject: Ozzy Things WITCHES: I'm glad to hear that good witches don't melt (Hopefully this applies to Locasta as well!). But some baddies like Coo-ee-oh seem not to either. Could meltability be particular to the Bastinda-Gingemma-Mombi-Singra clan? "NAME THAT OZZY TUNE"???: If anyone has seen "Inside the Dream Factory" on Turner Classic Movies, can you tell if that music for the closing credits is a genuine accompaniment for "Over the Rainbow", or is it a parody/pseudo-melody to emulate a tune still under copyright that they couldn't get permission to use? (As in "Chariots of Fire" in the movie _Mr. Mom_ and Enya's "Storms in Africa" in the Mercury car commercials, neither of which are the actual pieces but just "sound-alikes".) -- Dave ====================================================================== ] c/ \ /___\ *** THE OZZY DIGEST, OCTOBER 30, 1996 *** |@ @| | V | \\\ |\_/| | ;;; \-/ \ ;/ >< ] ===================================================================== Date: Tue, 29 Oct 1996 15:32:47 -0500 From: Homer Hey everybody. Just curious- what's LOTR? ====================================================================== Date: Tue, 29 Oct 1996 14:50:53 -0600 From: ABlair Subject: wizard of oz "clip art" X-URL: http://people.delphi.com/DaveH47/ I am looking for Wizard of Oz clip art for a presentation. Do you know if such a thing exists, and if so, can I find it on the 'net? I have located sites with photos from the movie, but none with clip art type images. Thanks for your help! A. Blair ====================================================================== Date: Tue, 29 Oct 1996 19:23:46 -0500 From: HermBieber@aol.com Subject: For Ozzy Digest For the Dave's: Don't worry about the Oz Wonderland War prices. Just enjoy! Actually, there are many items with dual prices. At recent IWOC convention auctions, the three volume set of OWW HAS been going for $30 pretty regularly. But to a generic comic book collector it is only worth 1/3 to 1/2 of that. But one has to consider the cost of visiting many comic book stores before a set is located at the lower prices. A similar situation exists with certain 1920 - 1940 vintage magazines that contain stories with marvelous ink sketches by John R. Neill. But these same magazines also contain cut-out Kewpie dolls, and the doll collectors bid up the prices to a far higher value than a Neill collector is willing to pay. For Tina, I have all the Bugles going back to the big bang (founding of the IWOC), plus many extra copies for sale. However unless you have a long term interest, you probably wouldn't want to spend the money. I can send you a xerox of the article in question as long as the IWOC doesn't sue me for copyright violation! For Malcolm, I'm finding a fair number of both Baum and Thompson Del Rey Oz paperbacks in both antiquarian shops and the PB exchange stores. And the prices are only a small fraction of the issue prices. However I don't bother to stock these because of space limitations. And, yes, there was loads of delicious food left over at the South Winkie Convention lunch! Herm Bieber ====================================================================== Date: Tue, 29 Oct 1996 23:53:15 -0500 From: Tyler Jones <104707.656@compuserve.com> Subject: Oz Tina: The only thing I know about the article you mentioned is what Farmer said about it in his non-FF-Compatible _A Barnstormer in Oz_. That is, I know it exists. It is not a major part of the story, so I can easily discuss it here. Apparantly, it is a MOPPeT of Dr. Rossman concerning the details of witches melted by water. Farmer and Rossman came up with these theories independently. They theorized that very old "red" (wicked) witches used concentrated electrical energy to keep alive. Water short-curcuited this and the witches would die/melt/whatever. Steve: Glad you're back. IRQ conflicts are a royal pain, but it happens sometimes and it is ineveitable given the large number of peripheral devices we have hooked up to our computers these days. I suppose we could standardize these so that each type of device will almost always want the same interrupt, but that's asking too much. --Tyler Jones ====================================================================== Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 09:37:12 -0500 From: DavidXOE@aol.com Subject: Ozzy Digest, 10-29-96 Ruth: The use of the term "witch" by the Oz authors is clearly not the same as the use by those who style themselves "witches" today (who do include numerous males). Nor is it that consistent with the use of the term by modern fantasy writers. I think that the Oz authors were fairly consistent in using the term to mean "a female human worker of magic", with not many, if any, further restrictions. Aside from references to Glinda as a sorceress, are there any female human workers of magic in the FF who are called anything but a "witch"? (OK, there are the two Yookoohoos, which is a term Baum made up. Are there any sorceresses or wizardesses or conjuresses or what-have-you? I don't remember any, but I haven't mentally scanned the whole canon.) Bear: I have the missing page, but would have to type it in to send it to the Digest, and I'm not sure that would be kosher anyhow. I will, however, copy it and send it to anyone who asks. I don't think the Iliad meets the requirement of "traveling a great distance to fulfill a preordained quest, against great odds;" Troy wasn't that far from Greece, even in those days, and the odds were all in favor of the Greeks from the start. The Odyssey, though, probably works, even though the goal of Odysseus was just to get home. That's all Dorothy wanted, after all. And the Aeneid works even better, though it's about a thousand years later in composition. David Hulan ====================================================================== Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 11:19:29 -0600 (CST) From: Ruth Berman Subject: ozzy digest/Tina X-Minuet-Version: Minuet1.0_Beta_16 X-POPMail-Charset: English Tina asked about Douglas A. Rossman's "On the Liquidation of Witches" (Bugle, spring 1969, vol. 13 no. 1, p. 17). This is rather a short article (1 typed page, and illo of Dorothy melting the WWW), and I don't think Doug would mind if it got put into the Digest. So -- On the Liquidation of Witches by Douglas A. Rossman The eradication of witches by immersion in water has left an indelible impression upon the minds of the readers of Oz books, in spite of the fact that this technique for ridding Oz of evil forces was used only twice in the entire series. the first time, of course, was in Chapter 12 of _The Wonderful Wizard of Oz_, when Dorothy destroyed the Wicked Witch of the West by throwing a pail of water on her. The second time was in the final chapter of _The Lost King of Oz_ when Old Mombi was washed out. As with most feats of magic performed in the Oz books, we are presented with a _fait accompli_ and are given no indication of precisely what is happening. These magical acts are seemingly unexplainable, and an observer is left with a sense of wonderment and awe. Nonetheless, both Robert R. Pattrick (in _Unexplored Territory in Oz_, International Wizard of Oz club, 1963, p. 15) and Barbara Greenberg (in _The Commonwealth of Oz, a Fairyland Image of America_, unpublished University of Texas thesis, 1966, chapter 4) have argued that Oz magic can be explained rationally. They maintain that it is an extention rather than a negation of natural laws, and that it is, in fact, based upon certain scientific principles. If we look upon the liquidation of witches by liquefaction in this light, the explanation of this dramatic technique proves to be both simple and reasonable. One of the basic chemical processes that occurs within the human body during digestion is called hydrolysis; simply put, this is a breaking down of large molecules by the addition of water. Surely this is what happens to a wicked witch who is immersed in water; her molecular structure is broken down and she simply dissolves. Like most biochemical processes, hydrolysis requires the presence of certain enzymes (catalysts that bring about a reaction without themselves being changed by it); were this not the case, hydrolysis would cause the breakdown of a great many things which are not supposed to be dissolved. In the case of a wicked witch one can only assume that the catalyst which permits this breakdown is the result of some subtle phsiological change that takes place in the body of a witch at the time she becomes adept in black magic. Certainly her training in the black arts enables a witch to perform self-transformations which transcend the normal biological limitations of the human body (for example, Old Mombi in _The Marvelous Land of Oz_ assumes the form of a rose, a shadow, a black ant, and a griffin). Presumably a good witch, who practices only white magic (Gloma, in _The Wishing Horse of Oz_, is exceptional for she is a good witch who has studied the black arts) would have nothing to fear from water. This relatively simple explanation of the process by which wicked witches are liquidated opens up intriguing new vistas for speculation. In another biological process we find that the small molecules that are the breakdown products of hydrolysis leave the digestive system and are transported to various parts of the body where they are combined to form larger molecules. The process by which small organic molecules are joined to form large ones is called dehydration synthesis, for it is accomplished by the removal of water from the smaller molecules. It is, in fact, just the opposite of hydrolysis. Allowing ourselves some poetic license, imagine what could happen if the dissolved remains of the liquidated witches actually have been saved in sealed containers over the years. It would not be a particularly difficult feat for some unscrupulous magician or sorcerer, applying the principle of dehydration synthesis, to restore Old Mombi and the Wicked Witch of the West to their former stature, and in league with these old mischief makers plot anew to overthrow Ozma and her companions in the Emerald City. ======================================================================