] c/ \ /___\ *** THE OZZY DIGEST, AUGUST 23 - 26, 1999 *** |@ @| | V | \\\ |\_/| | ;;; \-/ \ ;/ >< ] Ozzy Digest address: OzDigest@mindspring.com Private E-mail: DaveH47@mindspring.com Snail-Mail address: 9502 Erskine, Huntington Beach CA 92646 ===================================================================== = From: SeraMary@aol.com Date: Sun, 22 Aug 1999 19:20:11 EDT Subject: Re: The Ozzy Digest -- Back from the dead! (08-22-99) Are there any plans for a new " OZ " movie in the works? this year makes the movie 60 years old and next year makes the story 100 years old ! Lisa ===================================================================== = From: Ozmama@aol.com Date: Sun, 22 Aug 1999 20:23:31 EDT Subject: Re: The Ozzy Digest -- Back from the dead! (08-22-99) In a message dated 8/22/99 3:53:33 PM Central Daylight Time, OzDigest@mindspring.com writes: Dave Hulan:<< I suddenly lost most of the vision in my left eye. >> Scary! I'm glad all's well now. James Doyle: <> It's super, y'all. I hope you get a copy of it for yourself. I grabbed the CD at Winkies, where David Maxine had several for sale. So when do we move on to _Grampa_? Oh, Lisa, the king of Ragbad loses his head-literally--and that starts the plot moving. It's a quest format. His son, Tatters, searches for the king's lost head. He is accompanied by Grampa, an old soldier of the realm. Grampa is a curmudgeonly character. Other major characters include Urtha, a flower fairy, IIRC, and Bill, an iron weathercock who became animated when he ran into a live wire. I like the book. It's not the greatest in the series, but it's a good read. --Robin ===================================================================== = Date: Mon, 23 Aug 1999 07:36:17 +1000 From: Gehan Subject: Re: The Ozzy Digest -- Back from the dead! (08-22-99) Lisa: Here's a synopsis for _Grampa_ from the Del Rey edition: In which King Fumbo of Ragbad looses his head in a storm and Prince tatters accompanied by the wise and wonderful old soldier Grampa, sets off to find the king's head, a fortune and a princess. With Bill, a live iron weathercock, they visit a Wizard's Garden and discover Urtha, a lovely girl made of all flowers-and proceed to fall,swim,explode,sail and fly above and below Oz and Ev. Grampa in Co. eventually meet Dorothy herself, travelling with a Forgetful Poet in search of the missing princess of Perhaps City who has been condemned to marry a monster! ~Gehan~ ======================================== Climb Ev'ry Mountain Cross Ev'ry Stream Follow Ev'ry Rainbow 'Till you find you're dream --Mother Abbes (The Sound of Music) There's no place like home --Dorothy Gale (The Wizard of Oz) A bat in the hand is worth two in the belfry --The Joker (The Batman Adventures:"Mad Love") ===================================================================== = Date: Mon, 23 Aug 99 10:12:09 CST From: "Ruth Berman" Subject: welcome-backs to Oz Dave Hardenbrook: Welcome back. Would you put a reminder of your post-address in the next Digest? Probably some of us would like to donate something towards a share of the repair costs. // Why not go ahead and set a date to begin discussion of "Grampa"? // Did you attend the Winkie con? Maybe you (and others such as David Hulan and Justin Prichards) could put in some con-comments? Lisa Mastroberte: For a summary of "Grampa" -- well, the plot is mostly a reworking of "Kabumpo," except that in this case the wicked magician who transforms the princess has sent the prophecy of doom to the princess's castle, instead of to the prince's. The prince goes in quest of his fortune (and his father's head), and meets up with the others along the way in rather the same way. Instead of an elephant for the title-character comically choleric companion, he has his grandfather. Some of the characters are engaging, though, and there's effective use of different kinds of place (forest with bandits, ice- island in Nonestic, fire-island below ground, cloud people above, etc.). If you haven't already sent for a library copy, you could buy the paperback from the IWOC (and perhaps for the next few coming up). Paperbacks are affordable for most budgets, and don't take up a lot of shelf space. Email address for IWOC is iwoc@mailbox.neosoft.com if you want to find out about availability and prices. David Hulan: And a welcome back to you, too. J. L. Bell: I don't think the "You look like almost anyone."/"I feel the same way," exchange is a special idiom. Notta just means he's so shaken he doesn't know who he is and feels "like almost anyone." The "He broke himself, save the pieces" line plays on the idiom of "breaking the peace." // Munchkin con by way of Grand Canyon? Sounds pleasant, if roundabout. How about some con-comments? Laurie Jumpony: There was a discussion of chess sets on the Digest a good while back. There weren't any commercially made, but it was suggested that people could make their own by choosing illos of favorite characters (either small portraits or reducing them on the photocopy) and photocopying them onto colored card-stock, then cutting them out (with a base-strip included in the cut-out to fold back for a stand). Ruth Berman ===================================================================== = From: Tigerbooks@aol.com Date: Mon, 23 Aug 1999 14:24:45 EDT Subject: Oz prints by Stout At the San Diego Comic Con people kept telling me to go by William Stout's booth, so just before the show ended, I finally did. Thank heavens. Stout recently finished work as chief designer on the Oz theme park and couldn't relinquish Oz so quickly, so he did a series of six Oz prints. They are beautiful. They mix both book and movie imagery--Scarecrow dressed properly in blue, Lion looks like a lion not a man in a lion-suit, but the Winged Monkey is straight from the movie. Interestingly, Stout's drawn the Wicked Witch of the East, not the Wicked Witch of the West. The Glinda with Munchkins print is the weakest in my opinion, but the Scarecrow, Tin Woodman, and Lion are simply wonderful. They're a bit pricey--I think $900 for the full portfolio, and in the neighborhood of $250 for single prints, but that's hardly unusual for high qualifty limited edition prints. Even if you can't afford them, you should see them. There's a web-site: www.fineartpublishing.com where you can look at the prints, but the reproduction--at least on my computer--hardly does them full justice--sorta mottled and the color's off, but better than not seeing them at all. Best, Eric Shanower ===================================================================== = From: CruentiDei@cs.com Date: Tue, 24 Aug 1999 00:49:25 EDT Subject: Oz Dave and all: Welcome back, to you me and us! It's good to see the digest back again, and already I have a gripe! :-) The last digest but one was dated July 28-30 and the most recent one was dated August 1 - 22. Do I assume that there was no Digest for July 30? Seriously, it's good to see it back on line, and almost in time for Ozma's b-day! Dave: What's the deal with fans? The fan on my computer at work has died twice in the past year. Ruggedo must be up to something... :-) John Bell: Your comments about Button-Bright made me realize something. Both of his visits to Oz (or nearby) in the Baum 14 were similar: He simply arrived with little or no explanation of how he got there. From his comments in _Scarecrow_, we can assume that he went traveling with his Magic Umbrella, then lost it while exploring. Laurie the jumping pony (She may not be a member of the digest) I don't know offhand of any Ozzy chess sets for sale, although there was a discussion on the digest a few years back about who to cast as the various pieces. Tyler Jones ===================================================================== = From: "Warren H. Baldwin" To: "'Ozzy Digest'" Subject: Oz Digest 8/22 Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 15:49:31 -0500 Welcome back, Dave. Missed you! In the spirit of the IE, I have coined a new acronym, one badly needed on the Digest: AV, meaning Alternate View or Alternative View. Here, then, is my parting AV of _Cowardly_ before the next BCF takes effect. I think y'all are being unnecessarily harsh and intolerant toward poor Notta. Sure, he's acquired himself a set of rules that don't seem to work very well, but apparently they did up to the time of the story, else why would he have kept them? They don't seem to work so well in Oz, but as we all know, Oz is a unique country different from America, thank (your own personal diety or absence of one). The whole book takes place in a few days. Who among you could shed a lifestyle of years, perhaps decades, practically overnight? You will note that by the end of the adventure he realizes the futility of all but one rule, and I call that pretty good. At least he's not a fanatic. As for continuing to dress and make up as a clown, that's not his fault. I suspect that Ms. Thompson created Notta to be a permanent "character" at Ozma's court, and in order to be a "character" the like of the Scarecrow or Woodman, who are "naturally" different all the time, Notta has to be in character all the time, else we'd have Ozma saying something like "I'd like you to meet Notta, the clown," and the respondent saying something like "I see a lot of clowns here. Which one is Notta?" You will also notice that Bob Up has his own reservations about Notta, but doesn't voice them. What you have here, folks, is the old wise child theme at work. Notta serves the dual roles of adult figure and straw man (humor intended); he's _supposed_ to be aberrant, and I think he fills both slots very well. The target audience (kids, remember?) is supposed to see this along with Bob Up and be drawn into the story, and Ms. Thompson plotted better than was dreamt of in your philosophy. Sorry, but I thought that the plot and the characters fitted very "cozily," and I enjoyed _Cowardly_ immensely. Incidentally, in Chapter 1, Mudge is described as being in the southwestern part of the Munchkin Country, which is the mirror of reality according to the Haff-Martin map. (Hanff?) Was this discrepancy covered in previous Digests? Mr. Hulan: I've had eye problems similar to yours, and they give one food for thought. As to your other comments: There are a couple of reasons why a small group does most of the commentary on the Digest. The first is that views which don't fit into the consensus tend to be ignored or ridiculed. As for ignorance (if that's the word I want, and if at least one of you doesn't place the allusion, it will shatter my illusion), it hurts a person to be ignored. Here and there among those not in the self-perceived Digest peer group are a few who can tell in their low, cunning fashion that they are being ignored, and thereafter they don't waste their time making responses. Regarding ridicule, there are among you a few who are _extremely_ adept and effective in making personal attacks, and no one without the ability to retaliate in kind wishes to be a target, so they play it safe and never comment. The second reason is, I'm sure, no surprise to you: most people are bovine munchers when it comes to the pastures of the mind. This fact was known in Rome (bread and circuses were not then and are not now designed to satiate a proactive populace) and before. So with what, then, are you left? A small coterie of professionals, ex-professionals and would-be professionals who seem to enjoy without surcease the inbreeding of their own opinions. There is nothing wrong with this, of course. It is, merely, and was, predictable and natural. It's the same herd instinct which produces such social clubs as the Ku Klux Klan, the American Nazi Party, the White Supremacists, and the like. Quite harmless, and good entertainment as long as one of you doesn't become ein Fuhrer like wossname, the science fiction writer who created the cult that's taking over the Winkies, and tomorrow the world. These comments are, as always, my own opinion, and are given in the spirit of uplift. (:->) W. Baldwin ===================================================================== = Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 17:30:25 -0400 From: "J. L. Bell" Subject: Otto know better I went on vacation the same weekend that the Ozzy Digest did. I didn't make a stop at Chittenango, like last summer, but I did see things that had some slight connection to our earlier Ozzy discussions. One early stop was the Grand Canyon. I rode a mule named Happy six miles into the canyon and, even better, six miles out. Clearly she was a much bigger animal than Hank the Mule, as Neill depicts him. As Scott Olsen's daughter commented (Jan 1998 Ozzy Digest), Baum often calls Hank a "donkey" in TIK-TOK. Many of Baum's narrative details indicate he was indeed as small as a donkey or burro, not the size of the beast that carried me. I sure wouldn't want to share a bench on Quok's back with Happy, for instance. I flew back east for the Munchkin Convention in Harrisburg, largely devoted (like the others this year) to the MGM movie. A lushly illustrated book about the movie and its cultural legacy called THE WIZARDRY OF OZ, by Bill Stillman and Jay Scarfone and published by Random House, made its debut at this meeting. Look for it in stores soon. The Oz Research Table included Steve Teller's compilation of song lyrics from the many incarnations of the WIZARD OF OZ stage musical from the first decade of this century. One of those songs, I noticed, was titled "Hayfoot, Strawfoot." Baum has the Scarecrow stretch to make a pun on the term "strawfoot" in MAGIC (Dec 1998 Digest). After the convention, I moved on to Philadelphia and, at the recommendation of Peter Hanff, took in the Maxfield Parrish exhibit at the Academy of Fine Arts. A Way & Williams copy of MOTHER GOOSE IN PROSE was exhibited (credited to the Geo. M. Hill Company, oddly). Because my edition of that book is one of the circa-1980 reprints, I hadn't realized how large the original trim size was. Some of Parrish's drawings for MOTHER GOOSE IN PROSE use manufactured patterns for shading. The Humpty Dumpty art is particularly interesting. He drew Humpty and the castles behind him, cut them out, pasted that paper down over a parallel-line pattern that depicted the sky, and then drew in the spires of the castle (which would have been too slender to cut out). Neill used the same sorts of patterns (now, and perhaps then, called Benday) in his Oz artwork from SCARECROW through LOST PRINCESS (Apr 1998 Digest). Ruth Berman wrote: <> Several indications of money in Thompson's books seem to come from far outside the capital, as in Kimbaloo and its neighboring villages. That situation implies it's actually a remnant of the earlier system, rather than a new development in Ozma's economy. Ruth Berman wondered: <> I got the sense from EMERALD CITY that it was rather popular among the young people, as long as the professor didn't overdo it. "There was great laughter and shouting" from the athletes when Dorothy first visited, and the campus was obviously growing. Thompson in ROYAL BOOK and especially Neill/Shanower in RUNAWAY seem to have expanded the depiction of the Royal Athletic College. It's interesting that in doing so they made the Wogglebug from a harmless eccentric into an antagonist for kids (Zif, Alexample). Lisa Mastroberte wrote about GRAMPA: <> Take KABUMPO. Substitute Grampa for Kabumpo, Tatters for Pompa, a quest for the king's head for a quest for a proper princess. Mix well. At least that's how I remember GRAMPA. But I was looking forward to rereading the book after having seen Eloise Jarvis McGraw's article for the BUGLE about why she liked it more than any other Thompson title. Though, as my double-posted last message showed, I still have a few questions about COWARDLY LION before moving on. Folks noting versions of Oz as advice [that means you, Dave Godwin] might want to check out this URL: http://mgeneral.com/4-ebook/96-ebook/oz.htm It's management consulting squeezed into a modernized version of the movie's Emerald City. Can anyone enlighten me about why I think there was a character named Otto in one of the Oz books? Am I amalgamating Ato and his Octagon Isle? J. L. Bell JnoLBell@compuserve.com ===================================================================== = Date: Wed, 25 Aug 99 13:08:34 (PDT) From: Dave Hardenbrook Subject: Ozzy Things Thanks to everyone for my welcome back! OZ ON SCREEN (LARGE AND SMALL): Lisa wrote: >Are there any plans for a new " OZ " movie in the works? Well there's that Elizabeth Taylor thing and Tim Burton's TV series... Personally I'd have higher hopes if they did a Disney version of _Pride and Prejudice_... CHESS SETS: Does anyone recall in which Oz Gazette my article on making your own Ozzy chess set appeared? I tried to find it and couldn't... -- Dave ===================================================================== = To: Dave Hardenbrook From: Ozzy Digest Subject: Ozzy Digest, 08-27-99 Cc: Bcc: Ozzy_Digest_Members X-Attachments: In-Reply-To: References: Message-Id: <4.2.0.58.19990827134912.025640e0@pop.mindspring.com> X-Persona: ===================================================================== = ] c/ \ /___\ *** THE OZZY DIGEST, AUGUST 26 - 27, 1999 *** |@ @| | V | \\\ |\_/| | ;;; \-/ \ ;/ >< ] ===================================================================== = Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 18:27:25 -0500 (EST) From: cc: Dave Hardenbrook Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 06-22-99 > Nomes, Gnomes, and Knomes: > According to Baum, Nome means "One who knows". One who knows where all the > valuable treasure under the earth is located. Nomes-with-an-"N" appear to be > rock fairies. Nomes-with-a-"GN", according to most stories, are small > human-like creatures living in forests, and sometimes underground. IMHO, Baum > clearly meant "Nomes" to be different from Gnomes". "Gnome" is also derived from Baum's definition, as is the word "gnostic." > David (Godwin): > I agree with you. Nick Chopper is really heartless in _Patchwork in Girl of > Oz_ to rather let Dame Margolotte and Unk.Nunkie remain marble statues > forever rather than cutting the left wing of a yellow butterfly. Surely the > wing can be revived again by a wish? Speaking of wishes, why didnt Dr.Pipt > use his wishing pills to bring the marble statues back to life? That assumes Nikidik and Pipt are the same person. All we know about Nikidik is that he invented the wishing pills. My theory is that Pipt got the wishing pills from Nikidik or from abother source, but that he had nothing to do with Mombi. > I gather she's a female character. > > Jellia: In which case she should really be named "Ozma"! _Buffy's_ Oz is male. > FAIRIES: > John Bell wrote: > >Indeed, YEW and other Baum books hint that every country was a fairyland in > >the past. > > Is this one reason why Yew is considered in a different universe from > Nonestica? James E. Haff and Dick Martin didn't think so. > I still have faith that the "silent majority" is at least neutral if > not supportive of my views on the Ozma issue and will give my books a > fair chance. All I know is, when I bring the subject up at the South Winkie > Convention, they don't feel inclined to lynch me. :) Hey, the Ozma of my books likes the idea of a romantic story about her--albeit a fictional one. Scott ===================================================================== = Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 19:13:30 -0500 (EST) From: cc: Dave Hardenbrook , SCREEN-L@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 06-24-99 Though L. Frank Baum did act under the name George Brooks, that was on stage, and I doubt the accuracy of this listing. Can anyone confirm it? I don't think he was in the best of health at this point, but it may have been in the can for quite a while before it was released. Flash of Fate, The (1918) Directed by Elmer Clifton Writing credits James W. Atchison (story) Waldemar Young Genre: Drama / Crime Buy related Books User Rating: awaiting 5 votes. Cast (in credits order) Herbert Rawlinson .... Randolph Shorb Sally Starr .... Mary Freeman Jack Nelson .... Joe Freeman Dana Ong .... Henry Shorb Madge Kirby .... Gertrude Shorb Willis Marks .... Abner Hinman Charles West (I) .... Philadelphia Johnson rest of cast listed alphabetically L. Frank Baum .... Dave Hinman (as George Brooks) Directed by Elmer Clifton Writing credits (in credits order) James W. Atchison (story) Waldemar Young (scenario) and W.B. Pearson (scenario) Produced by Herbert Rawlinson Cinematography by Virgil Miller (as Virgil E. Miller) Production Companies Universal Film Manufacturing Company [us] Distributors Universal Film Manufacturing Company [us] Also Known As: Crookedest Man in the World, The (1918) (USA) Country: USA Color: Black and White Sound Mix: Silent ==================================================== Scott Andrew Hutchins http://php.iupui.edu/~sahutchi Oz, Monsters, Kamillions, and More! "Love is not a positive emotion that begins in us and ends in the positive response of someone else. Love is divine energy that comes from God and has no end." --Eric Butterworth ===================================================================== = Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 19:28:17 -0500 (EST) From: cc: Dave Hardenbrook Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 06-28-99 I can't find the Bumpy Man in _RTO_, but I did find Rinkitink. He's next to Tommy Kwikstep in the procession, before they gather around the throne. I got my widescreen copy the other day (which I had to special order on the tenth because there were none, and when it finally came it was the only ws one) and it had a bunch of glitches like they had used a damaged used tape, so I have to exchange it. anyway, what's important here is that I noticed Speedy in the background during the procession. I guess that's who it was supposed to be, because he had flying goggles. He's in the background when Dorothy is riding the Lion with what looks like the Mustafa of Mudge next to her. Scott ===================================================================== =========== Scott Andrew Hutchins http://php.iupui.edu/~sahutchi Oz, Monsters, Kamillions, and More! "Love is not a positive emotion that begins in us and ends in the positive response of someone else. Love is divine energy that comes from God and has no end." --Eric Butterworth ===================================================================== = From: "sprichards" Subject: Ozzy Questions & Answers for the Ozzy Digest! Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 17:37:33 -0700 Hi everyone! J.L. Bell wrote: Can anyone enlighten me about why I think there was a character named Otto in one of the Oz books? Am I amalgamating Ato and his Octagon Isle? Let's see. I've just skimmed my Famous Forty collection and I really don't know if there is any character named Otto. You are right about King Ato. (Perhaps you are thinking of Otto the Gnome Prince from the Oz Kid movies) Otto is also T O T O reversed! But I really don't know. "QUESTION OF THE MONTH: What is your favorite Thompson, Baum, Neil, Snow, etc book in the famous forty? My personal favorites are: FAVORITE BAUM: Glinda of Oz FAVORITE THOMPSON: Ojo in Oz (a touching story, I loved it!) Grampa in Oz, Pirates in Oz, and The Wishing Horse of Oz Favorite Neil: Lucky Bucky in Oz Favorite Snow: The Shaggy Man of Oz Favorite Cosgrove: (Out of Hidden Valley and Wicked Witch) IT'S A TIE! Favorite McGRAW: (Out of Forbidden Fountain and Merry-Go-Round) Merry-Go-Round in Oz. And I think I'm almost ready to move on to GRAMPA IN OZ I really don't like the last color plate of Ozma...she just looks weird with braids over her shoulder Other than that, the colored plates are wonderful in the book. And my new ozzy E-Mail address starting soon I hope will be KABUMPO@HOTMAIL.COM See ya'! From, Kabumpo. ===================================================================== = Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 19:50:58 -0500 (EST) From: cc: Dave Hardenbrook Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 07-09-99 > < when I was a kid... > -- That the Emerald City was entirely "indoors".>> > > Especially in the large crowd scenes, the MGM Emerald City does appear much > more obviously to be on a sound stage than the corresponding scenes in > Munchkinland--probably because the sky is greenish rather than the familiar > blue. Only when my attention is forced to the sky by the witch on her > broomstick or the Wizard taking off do I remember that the city square is > supposed to be outdoors. I just saw _Lili_ the other day, and had the impression that the carnival was outdoors. Typical of MGM prior to 1960. > As for Glinda as Dorothy's mother, my grandmother firmly believes that > the scientist referred to as "Keys" in E.T. was Elliot's father, come home > at last. Do you think that had anything to do with her anxiety over my > father's divorce? We looked at E.T. in my film theory course for psychoanalysis, and we considered him a replacement father figures, as was ET--particularly in the scene when he sat in the T-shirt getting drunk on beer and watching _The Quiet Man_. > COWARDLY LION: > Call me an un-American pinko, but I've always hated clowns, which > probably explains why I don't like _Cowardly Lion of Oz_... Just like Tim Burton. I don't like clowns much, either, even though there was one in my last class who is an okay guy. Clowns are scary. Clowns are inherently evil. :) > One bit of _Cowardly Lion_-related strangeness: In this semester just > ended my Java teacher's first name was Mustafa. (Anyone else here > ever known anyone with an unintentionally "Ozzy" name?) "Mustafa" is a common Arabic name, though itdentoes royalty similar to that of the Mustafa. That reminds me. There are two Edward Hydes in the Indianapolis phone book. There is also an Oliver Stone and several Bruce Campbells. Scott ===================================================================== = Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 19:52:52 -0500 (EST) From: cc: Dave Hardenbrook Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 07-09-99 Also, Aysen Mustafa is a researcher for the Australian Film Institute. I'm on a listserv he posts to occasionally. Scott ===================================================================== =========== Scott Andrew Hutchins http://php.iupui.edu/~sahutchi Oz, Monsters, Kamillions, and More! "Love is not a positive emotion that begins in us and ends in the positive response of someone else. Love is divine energy that comes from God and has no end." --Eric Butterworth ===================================================================== = Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 20:16:31 -0500 (EST) From: sahutchi@iupui.edu cc: Dave Hardenbrook Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 07-02-99 It's disappointing that Anchor Bay wasn't able to use the British cut (113 min.) for their release. www.videoparadise.com, I British retialer does not have it (and then it would need PAL conversion). Cory Quinn: The hand-coloring story is true for _The Fairylogue and Radio Plays_, but color filmmaking began in its most primitive (2-color) version in the mid 1920s. ================================================== Scott Andrew Hutchins http://php.iupui.edu/~sahutchi Oz, Monsters, Kamillions, and More! "Love is not a positive emotion that begins in us and ends in the positive response of someone else. Love is divine energy that comes from God and has no end." --Eric Butterworth ===================================================================== = From: CruentiDei@cs.com Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 23:18:13 EDT Subject: Oz Warren: I don't know if anybody has ever covered the corner-ness of Mudge specifically, but the whole east-west thing has had quite a bit of discussion. It does seem that Thompson mixed them up very often. Warren again: I'll take this opportunity to disagree somewhat with your discourse on the the number of people who regularly post. My disagreement is in a small matter, though. I agree with most of what you said. However, it has always seemed to me that most Digesters are very tolerant of ignorance. That is to say, those who know little of Oz. We're always ready to lend a helping hand or give a little lecture on things. Many of us who have read all of the books, etc. understand that not many others have, so we are eager and willing to share our knowledge in a friendly manner. As for the rest of what you said, so true, so true. John Bell, You "Otto" be in pictures :-) Nope. I can't remember an Otto offhand, and there is no mention of this personage in any of my lexicons. You are probably thinking of Ato, as you remarked. Unless, that is, somebody writes _Otto von Bismarck_ in Oz, or that little dog from "Beetle Bailey" comes to visit Toto :-) Tyler Jones ===================================================================== = From: SeraMary@aol.com Date: Fri, 27 Aug 1999 00:58:41 EDT Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 08-26-99 I have a great idea for an OZ book ! TEll me what u think !! ok? It is the anniversary of when WWE was demised by Dorothy. Plus, Mombi as usual wants to overthrow OZ again. But, this time for good ! Mombi moves into the WWW's castle and finds long lost hidden arts of bringing people back to life, the power of fire etc etc .... So, she cooks up the best idea yet ! She brings back WWW and WWE and they all plot to take control over OZ . Their new plan works and everything is put into gear. The YBR, Dorothy's old house, and poppy field and Emerald City is in RUINS . Then its up to me, or the person who wants to write the story, on which way they want to go. Ozma becomes dethroned and made into TIP once more ! But, does the author want to have OZ conquered and start anew ? OR does someone from OZ or OUTSIDE OZ save OZ ? What do you think ? I'd like some feedback. My name is Lisa Marie ( The same person who asked about if there was going to be a new OZ movie coming soon ! ) I'd like your opinion . Lisa Marie ===================================================================== = From: "Nathan Mulac DeHoff" Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 08-26-99 Date: Fri, 27 Aug 1999 08:02:24 PDT Ruth: >Instead of an elephant >for the title-character comically choleric companion, he has his >grandfather. Well, Grampa isn't technically Tatters' grandfather (Thompson mentions that he's a bachelor), but he clearly serves the same role. Naming the character "Grampa" only makes that more obvious. Tyler: >Seriously, it's good to see it back on line, and almost in time for Ozma's >b-day! Actually, it was a day after Ozma's birthday, which falls on 21 August. Warren Baldwin: > Incidentally, in Chapter 1, Mudge is described as being in the >southwestern part of the Munchkin Country, which is the mirror of reality >according to the Haff-Martin map. (Hanff?) Was this discrepancy covered in >previous Digests? I guess it was just hard to find a proper southwestern area in a country shaped like the Munchkin. Haff and Martin usually reverse east and west in Thompson's books, due to the fact that she often placed the Munchkin Country in the west and the Winkie in the east, but she didn't do this in _Cowarldy Lion_. Nathan _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com ===================================================================== = Date: Fri, 27 Aug 1999 11:53:54 -0400 From: "J. L. Bell" Subject: save the peace Ruth Berman wrote: <> I hadn't considered this possibility. Unfortunately, I still don't see it. Or hear it, or whatever you do with puns. Darn. Tyler Jones wrote: <> This is part of a pattern that makes me consider Button-Bright even more lucky than Ojo. In the entire Outside and Inside world, only he could get totally lost and be discovered by Dorothy, one of the world's best at getting home. Only he could lose his magical transportation in a strange country [Mo is very strange], get buried in a blizzard, and end up meeting two old friends. It's no wonder that when there's only one known remedy for having a fox head, Button-Bright literally falls into it. That when Ozma is missing, he finds her while seeking breakfast. And that the very instant he's about to be eaten by wild animals, Glinda rescues him from afar. If I were ever to lose anything important in the Emerald City, I'd simply (a) find Button-Bright, and (b) have him empty his pockets. Step (a) would be the hard one, of course. Warren Baldwin wrote: <> Good point. On the other hand, they've worked only well enough to get him to a two-ring tent show in Stumptown. Warren Baldwin wrote: <> I think you're right about Thompson's hope to create another permanent celebrity, like Sir Hokus. It's interesting that they're both based on familiar types--a medieval knight and a circus clown--rather than a truly novel, who-knows-what-to-expect personage like a tin woodman. And in both cases Thompson gives the man another level of depth below the stereotype. In Notta's case, I think there's only one level, though, and it wears thin. I don't begrudge Notta his choice to be a clown, though his anxiety at being caught without makeup is so acute that it comes across as troubling. Rather, it's Notta's insistence at *not* greeting people as a clown that's frustratingly obtuse. Bob keeps having to yell, "It's Notta!" because he knows his painted friend is just fine as is. "'Why, it's a clown!' cried Dorothy in delight" when she sees Notta in his real persona [251]. Most people in Oz would be merely curious about this new type of man, the story hints; it's Notta's overwhelming bad luck that he meets almost nobody but crabs. [Apologies to real crabs.] Another result of Thompson's choice to focus COWARDLY LION on Notta learning to do without disguises means that he doesn't show a lot of personality beyond that. Unlike Sir Hokus, there's not really an interesting character to carry on with. And indeed, Thompson rarely brought him back. [One quality that might have made a more lasting character is to bring forward Notta's feelings of paternal responsibility, producing a paradox of the clown who's also an anxious, busy adoptive father.] Warren Baldwin wrote: <> I agree about Bob and Notta's role-reversal. It would have been more satisfying for me if Bob had ever spoken to Notta about the mistakes he perceived, or took a leadership role in their little band. That he doesn't (to my recollection, at least) seems due to how Thompson portrayed him as so young. He may be wiser than his years, but he's still such a little kid. Warren Baldwin wrote: <> I'm sorry you feel this way. I haven't perceived such behavior for many months, and in that time I've had disagreements and debates with Digest members who hold strong opinions, voice them articulately, and continue to do so. Most posters do indeed seem to have disliked COWARDLY LION, but there were also people who wrote in favor of it (and of Notta), and invitations for more such comments. I hope many more contribute. J. L. Bell JnoLBell@compuserve.com ===================================================================== = Date: Fri, 27 Aug 99 15:01:36 CST From: "Ruth Berman" Subject: Notta in Oz Warren H. Baldwin: Interesting defense of Notta's rules for survival. I think what's oddest about them is that as badly as they work for him in Oz, they seem even more unlikely as something that would have been working for him in America. The parts about being polite, telling jokes, and running might have worked pretty well, but it's mostly the part about disguises that gets him into trouble in Oz, and it seems likely that they'd do the same in America. Maybe the huntsman and bear guises could be useful, but the fish and lion disguises wouldn't be convincing, surely, and the witch might draw unwanted attention. Unless the idea is keep the rubes from knowing which circus employee had annoyed them? But then that would be getting the circus as a whole in trouble? I think RPT might have intended the implausibility of some parts of Notta (his rules, his horror of being seen out of clown-dress) to be comic, but in other ways the characterization is more realistic. It's not like, say, J.M. Barrie's play about Harlequin, where the whole joke, consistently present in the action, is that the characters' entire lives are lived in a world the same as the world of the stage-pantomime. In some moods, I think the comedy of Notta's implausibility works as comedy, but in others I find myself convinced by those who've been arguing that the shift between Notta as someone who lives in a world that is the same as his on- stage existence and Notta as someone who can be offstage as well as on is too clumsy to work as comedy. The geographical discrepancy -- RPT was following the map of Oz as it was drawn, and she assumed that east was on the right-hand side. She was not following the compass rose of the map, which was backwards, and showed that east was on the left. Curiously, Denslow also got the directions reversed in his drawing of a weather vane in "Wizard." And Baum was often inconsistent himself about east-west directions. There really was no way that RPT could have treated the directions (short of avoiding mention of east/west entirely) that would have been consistent. I'm sorry to learn that you feel that "non-consensus" views are generally ignored or ridiculed on the Digest. It doesn't really seem to me that there's that much of a consensus, especially considering the way we argue over all these assorted details, but it's certainly possible that sometimes comments could be deserving of more attention or more agreement than they get. And yet there isn't really an easy solution to the problem of being ignored, because throwing in "Me, too" comments to everyone people agree with would tend to bloat the Digest in a way that might make it difficult to read. Some of your comments, though (as with the comparison to the Klan) seem more acidic than the kinds of disagreements I recall being registered on the Digest as a rule. (Part of the problem, of course, is in communicating in writing. Comments that were meant as mild "joshing" can come across as harsh "ridicule," and, contrariwise, trying to avoid humorous lightness can come across as a pompous and condescending heaviness, in the absence of tone-of-voice to give the speaker's intention.) Rather than making a general complaint about a habit of ridicule, it might be more useful to complain at the specific times when you feel a disagreement has descended to ridicule. Ruth Berman ===================================================================== = To: Dave Hardenbrook From: Ozzy Digest Subject: Ozzy Digest, 08-29-99 Cc: Bcc: Ozzy_Digest_Members X-Attachments: In-Reply-To: References: Message-Id: <4.2.0.58.19990829132742.02209e90@pop.mindspring.com> X-Persona: ===================================================================== = ] c/ \ /___\ *** THE OZZY DIGEST, AUGUST 28 - 29, 1999 *** |@ @| | V | \\\ |\_/| | ;;; \-/ \ ;/ >< ] ===================================================================== = Date: Fri, 27 Aug 1999 17:59:21 -0500 Subject: Oz From: "David Godwin" Warren H. Baldwin wrote: > As to your other comments: There are a couple of reasons why a small >group does most of the commentary on the Digest. The first is that views >which don't fit into the consensus tend to be ignored or ridiculed. That has not been my experience, although I would not by any means consider myself one of the inner circle - the "small coterie" spoken of later on - and I don't think I've necessarily fit in with the consensus on many issues, either through my own lack of knowledge or through just plain disagreement. I can recall being ignored only once, and that may well have been because no one knew the answer to my question. I have never been ridiculed, unless I was too unperceptive to notice it. The worst I can say about the Digest is that I have sometimes gotten the feeling that it is impossible for me to say anything whatever in this forum without someone contradicting me, usually from a position of superior knowledge (real or assumed) and sometimes a bit superciliously. Once in a great while I have gotten arguments from people who seemed to be trying to claim some sort of higher moral ground than I had just claimed! Most of the contradictions, whether of fact or opinion, have been courteous, however, and have been worded as inoffensively as anyone could desire. I have also occasionally noticed a tendency toward what sometimes seems to be a stubborn determination to misunderstand or misinterpret what I am trying to say, to the point where I despair of being able to explain myself on some very simple and straightforward observation and to the point where I feel I am being contradicted out of some sort of perverse need to contradict, no matter what. ("Nice day." "No, it's not!") I have a tendency to overreact to this, I'm sure, but I do find it rather annoying. The bottom line is that, yes, I have noticed a certain cliqueishness (if there's such a word) about the Digest, and I have seen it directed at a few other people much more so than toward myself - but, what the hey, it's kind of unavoidable. You should hear Civil War re-enactors talk among themselves about the "tourons" (tourist-morons). It's a very similar situation: the re-enactors see education as a large part of their function, just as the older and more experienced Digesters are willing and eager to impart information about Oz to honest and intelligent newbies, but there are always a certain number of people who, shall we say, require more patience and understanding than others. As for me, I have not been contributing lately as much as I have done heretofore, not because I got my feelings hurt somehow, but because I've been awfully, awfully busy. > So with what, then, >are you left? A small coterie of professionals, ex-professionals and >would-be professionals who seem to enjoy without surcease the inbreeding of >their own opinions. A rather harsh judgment, I'd say, but eloquent and not without a grain of truth. _Grampa in Oz_: I did not like this book for a number of reasons, and, having nothing favorable or unusually perceptive to say about it, I will refrain from commenting on it. - David G. ===================================================================== = Date: Sat, 28 Aug 1999 09:26:52 -0500 Subject: Oz calendars From: "David Godwin" Does anyone know where the original Neill drawings are? It seems to me it would be very nice to have an Oz calendar made up of his art as opposed to calendars based on The Movie or the kiddie calendar put out by The Club. - David G. ===================================================================== = Date: Sat, 28 Aug 1999 14:19:55 -0500 From: David Hulan Subject: Re: The Ozzy Digest -- Back from the dead! (08-22-99) Glad to see the Digest back, though it's taken me a few days and a few Digests to get around to responding. 8/22: J.L.: I think the biggest reason there aren't any definite examples of magic working in the outside world in Baum's Oz books is that there is very little time spent in the outside world in Baum's Oz books. About three pages in _Wizard_, a chapter in _Ozma_, a chapter in _DotWiz_, a chapter in _Road_, a chapter in _EC_, a page or maybe two in _Tik-Tok_, a chapter in _Scarecrow_, and that's it. And it's arguable that magic did work in the outside world in _Scarecrow_; what besides magic (counting mermaids as magic) rescued Trot and Cap'n Bill from the whirlpool? Can you think of a possible natural cause? For that matter, if we accept your firm belief that Oz is physically on our Earth, then there must be magic working in our world as well; there's no other way in which a tornado can carry something from the central US to a place that's somewhere well out into the Pacific Ocean, so magic worked in our world in either _Wizard_ or _Ozma_. 8/26: Ruth: I second your request to Dave to put his snail-mail address in the Digest again soon; I'd like to send a contribution to help defray the cost of his computer repair. And trying to track back which earlier one had it would be tedious at best (though I think Sherlock could probably find it). Atticus is going to be doing the Official Winkie report for the Oz Observer, but I'll toss in the one that I did for _Penny-Ice and Cold Meat_, since it's just a cut-and-paste. --------------------- The Butterfly Grove Inn, where the pre-conference evening is held, has been remodeling and some of the rooms are much nicer than anything they had before. Unfortunately, this also means they're pricier, which is a bit annoying. As usual, the Oogaboos (Oz fans from the Pacific Northwest - Lynn and Betsy Beltz, Marilyn and Karyl Carlsen, and I think one or two others whose names escape me at the moment) hosted a pre-dinner party for conversation, and then about 30 of us drove out to Carmel to a restaurant recommended by Robin Hess, the program chairman for this year's Winkies. It was called Stravaganza, if I recall aright, and the food was quite good though not superb. Still, for serving that many people at once they did extremely well. When we got back to the Inn we discovered that a couple of people who hadn't gone to the dinner had taken the life-size Patchwork Girl Karyl Carlsen always brings and put her on the floor in a highly debauched state, with two empty wine bottles and various other signs of dissipation. I hope that some of the pictures that were taken came out and that I can get a copy of one for the Oz Observer. Friday I realized that I hadn't packed enough books to last me the trip, or at least they might not, so I made a run into Monterey to Bay Books and picked up three more Just In Case. Then I drove back out to Carmel, to the same shopping center where Stravaganza was located, looking for a good place for lunch. And I found one - a combined seafood store and restaurant where I had one of the best Crab Louie salads I've ever eaten. Lots of crab, very fresh lettuce, and a nice dressing, along with the various other ingredients. And for quite a reasonable price. Then it was on to Asilomar, where I registered for the convention, got my room assignment, and un-packed. The welcoming reception in the courtyard outside the building where most of the program-ming would be held was enlivened by a game; each new arrival had the name of an Oz character taped to his/her back, and was supposed to figure out who the character was by asking yes/no questions of others. It was actually a pretty good mixer, though obviously it helped if you could ask questions of people who were highly knowledgeable about the books. A movie fan isn't going to know how to answer questions about King Krewl, for instance, who was my character. (The two passing them out - Marilyn Carlson and Betsy Beltz - did seem to try to give newcomers easy characters like Dorothy or the Scarecrow, and hand the more obscure ones to people like me who know the books well.) Dinner was decent - some kind of chicken thing, as I recall - but it was as I was walking back to my room after dinner that it seemed as if someone had plunked a drop of ink into my left eye. Actually, of course, it was blood, but you can't really tell the difference from the inside. I still had peripheral vision, and light and dark could come through the dark part, but there was no resolution over most of my field of vision. I had a pretty good idea what had happened; I'm not an expert on physiological optics, but I made a living in optics for a good many years and I know enough to figure out the basics. There was parallax between the center of my field of view and the dark spot depending on what direction I was looking, so it wasn't right on the retina. And it had that swirly look to it like you'll see if you put a drop of ink into water; what I was seeing was a dark liquid dispersing in a clear liquid. If it had gotten worse I suppose I'd have had no choice but to go to an ER somewhere, but after the initial burst it seemed to stabilize, so I decided to wait till I got home and could see my regular ophthalmologist. Nevertheless, it put a considerable damper on my enthusiasm for the rest of the conference, not to mention just about eliminating my depth perception. The program that night was interesting, but I'll have to confess that I was spending more time trying to decide how bad my eye was than paying attention to what was going on. I remember a show and tell, and David Maxine gave the same slide/sound talk on music related to the 1903 Wizard of Oz stage play that he gave at Ozmopolitan last year. I think this may have been when Jane Albright gave her pitch for the Centennial Convention as well. Friday morning I got up in time for the costume pa-rade, which was pretty good this year. (Last year's had been rather thin.) After that I was charged with giving all the quizzes; Fred Meyer had sent in a quiz for the children, but neither Barb DeJohn, who won the adult quiz last year, nor Alex Edwards, who'd won the Masters', had come to the convention or provided a quiz. Barb had appealed to me to write an adult quiz in her stead, at least, so I had a quiz ready, and when there was no Masters' quiz available it was agreed to have a "flighted" event, with both Masters and adults taking the same quiz, but with the adult winner to be the person with the top score who wasn't a Master. It worked out pretty well; surprisingly, all three Masters who took the quiz had the same score-34 of 36, and the top non-master (who was barely old enough for the adult quiz) scored 31. Also ironically, the winner of the children's quiz was the sister of the winner of the adult quiz. Then there was lunch, and following that the auc-tion. I only bought one item, a first edition of The Cowardly Lion of Oz. I'm gradually replacing my black-and-white editions with older ones that have the color plates; I don't really care about first edition status, but I want the plates and that's often the only way to get them. I still need color-plate editions of Glinda (but I'll get that in a year or so when Books of Wonder puts out a facsimile), Grampa, Gnome King, Jack Pumpkinhead, Yellow Knight, Purple Prince, and Ojo. And I'll probably be a grand poorer by the time I have them all, *sigh*. The main program that evening was the Winkie Players performing a stage adaptation of Dorothy and the Wizard in Oz. The playwright, who did the adaptation for the school where he teaches and not specifically for Oz fans, changed the emphasis of the story quite a bit, but it was true enough in spirit and the characters were recognizably the ones from the book. As you'd expect from a play that half the cast hadn't even seen before they arrived at Asilomar, the production showed more enthusiasm than finesse, but it was a lot of fun and I'd rather like to see the play put on sometime with a cast that's actually had a couple of weeks to-gether to rehearse. I didn't party as late this time as I did last year, though I didn't leave until after midnight. I was still concerned about my eye (though it had been getting a bit better if anything through the course of the day), which put a damper on my enjoyment. Driving back to San Jos the next day was Interest-ing, given my lack of depth perception. It wasn't bad on the highway, but getting in and out of parking places-even diagonal ones-was no fun. However, I managed without dinging my car or anyone else's and flew back to Chicago (in a full plane this time), where Marcia met me and I told her the bad news. --------------------- Obviously this is more a narrative that I created for a bunch of personal friends than an objective report on a convention, but it should give you an idea what went on. Tyler: The fan on my wife's computer died earlier this year as well, FWIW. Warren: You sure must have gotten up on the wrong side of the bed the morning you wrote this! Or at least it doesn't sound at all like your previous posts; maybe you were seething inside and hiding it then. But what you're describing doesn't sound remotely like the Ozzy Digest that I've been reading the last three or four years. Ridicule? Could you give a specific example? I don't recall anyone ridiculing anyone else's posts, certainly not in the BCF discussions. Disagreement isn't ridicule, unless it's couched in terms that make the other person sound stupid, and I don't recall any of that. I can remember a very few personal attacks, but the last one was at least six months ago and I think longer, and it didn't have anything to do with BCF discussions. >It's the same herd instinct which >produces such social clubs as the Ku Klux Klan, the American Nazi Party, >the White Supremacists, and the like. Quite harmless, and good >entertainment as long as one of you doesn't become ein Fuhrer like >wossname, the science fiction writer who created the cult that's taking >over the Winkies, and tomorrow the world. I suppose that those organizations you mention are in part produced by a herd instinct, but so are most human organizations; why limit it to those of which you (I suppose) strongly disapprove? The "small coterie of professionals, ex-professionals and would-be professionals who seem to enjoy without surcease the inbreeding of their own opinions" seems to me to be more closely related to organizations like the American Contract Bridge League or the US Chess Federation or the Jane Austen Society - a group of people with an avid interest in an activity that's quite pointless from the standpoint of the Greater Society, but also quite harmless in all its manifestations, present and potential. Or do you have some theory as to how a dozen or so people on the Ozzy Digest might threaten anyone with their nit-picking analysis of the fine points of the Oz books? J.L.: The earliest indication of the Woggle-bug as an antagonist to kids was probably in _Magic_, when some of the students threw him into the river. I don't know why you're remembering a character called Otto in the Oz books. If you've watched the Oz Kids videos then you might be remembering Prince Otto, the Nome King's son. 8/27: Assuming that there's more to this Digest than 1 1/2 posts from Scott H. (one of which has already appeared), mine got truncated. Scott: Haff and Martin were trying to put every fictional country Baum ever wrote about onto their map, but there's no textual evidence that Yew - or Quok, or Macvelt, or a number of the other countries on that map - are in fact part of Nonestica. Eric Gjovaag feels so strongly that Yew isn't in Nonestica that he quit the Digest after too many people argued with him about it. David Hulan ===================================================================== = From: "Kenneth R. Shepherd" Subject: Oz matters Date: Sat, 28 Aug 1999 20:18:00 -0400 Dave Hardenbrook: Congrats on your new system! Hope that it works even better than the old one did for you.... Since the discussion for GRAMPA seems to be underway, here's something to keep the ball rolling.... Originally Posted: Sat, 28 Feb 1998 17:06:31 -0500 ******WARNING: POSSIBLE SPOILERS FOR "GRAMPA" AHEAD******** Day 1 - Fumbo loses his head Day 2 - Grampa & Tatters start on expedition at 8 AM - meet Bill at evening, bandits at night - night in forest - "On the same bright morning that Grampa and Tatters started from Ragbad," Gorba kidnaps Pretty Good from Perhaps City - Prophecy of Abrog ("in four days a monster shall marry the Princess") - Percy Vere meets Dorothy - night in forest Day 3 - Grampa & Tatters escape robbers before dawn - meet Urtha in garden, leave garden at night- Dorothy & Percy breakfast in woodcutter's cottage, taken by washerwomen Day 4 - Grampa's party visits Fire Island & escapes through Blazes - night on lava island Day 5 - Grampa's party visits Iso Poso - flight to Oz - discover Fumbo's head - "The two days Grampa and his little party had been adventuring in the wizard's garden, on Fire Island and Isa Poso, Dorothy, Toto and the Forgetful Poet had spent as prisoners on Monday Mountain" - Dorothy, Toto & Percy escape washerwomen - the two parties meet - camp in field at night Day 6 - The party meets the Playfellows - Urtha escapes to Maybe Mountain - Urtha married to Tatters ("it was the fourth day mentioned in Abrog's prophecy"), disenchanted - marriage celebration in Ragbad late into night Day 7 - "Not until after the loud crows of Bill announced the rising of the sun did the party break up" Day 8 - "After luncheon the next day" Dorothy, Toto, Peer Haps & Percy return to their homes ****************END SPOILERS***************** One of the few things on which David Hulan and I disagree is on our choices for favorite Oz books. He considers GRAMPA one of the weakest of Thompson's books; I think it's one of the best, and it's my personal favorite. I suspect the reason I like it so well has to do with her wonderful handling of of the major story elements, such as the the budding relationship between Tatters and Urtha. GRAMPA is also a very tightly plotted book, and there's very little in it that is not relevant to the plot. I remember that some months ago there was a discussion about IEs, and someone indicated that GRAMPA was an example of Thompson's use of lots of IEs. I found a useful statement by the science fiction writer Orson Scott Card in a book titled _Characters and Viewpoint_. Card divides stories into four basic groups: milieu, idea, character, and events, depending on what the major focus of the story is. Based on his descriptions, many Oz stories would fall into the milieu category, in which the world surrounding the characters is the primary focus. He writes that in milieu stories "the author feels free to digress from the main story line with long passages of explanation, description, or depiction of the culture." So (by this argument) the IEs found throughout the Oz series do in fact serve a purpose: they remind the reader that (s)he is journeying in an alien land, and that expectations may often be frustrated (or unexpectedly fulfilled). But the reason I like GRAMPA is because it's primarily not a milieu story. It's what Card calls an "events" story, in which the protagonists are trying to cope with a world-changing problem (in this case, the loss of Fumbo's head and the search for Ragbad's prosperity). Each of the major events in the story advances the plot, occasionally by frustrating Prince Tatters' efforts to find romance, wealth, and his father's head; but also by introducing elements that will be important in the later unravelling of the story. Although the "enchanted Princess" motif is one that Thompson had used before (in KABUMPO) and would use again (with a twist in SILVER PRINCESS, and with a change of gender in OJO), I think GRAMPA shows her in top form. A book like this rivals (and in my opinion surpasses) Baum at his finest. Best, KRS ===================================================================== = From: Ozmama@aol.com Date: Sat, 28 Aug 1999 21:55:06 EDT Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 08-26-99 In a message dated 8/26/99 5:02:42 PM Central Daylight Time, OzDigest@mindspring.com writes: << Maybe you (and others such as David Hulan and Justin Prichards) could put in some con-comments? >> Isn't Justin the young man who won the children's quiz? Very knowledgeable youngster! The con was fun, and Asilomar was, as usual, gorgeous, although the blight on the Monterey Pines is saddening. They'll be gone in 5-7 years, we're told. :( But Asilomar will still be there and, hopefully, so will the Winkies. I can't remember it all right now, but Rick Wiegand's original version of _Dorothy and the Wizard of Oz_ was a hoot on Saturday night. Sheerly fun--clever and silly--good combo, and we all enjoyed it, whether in the cast or in the audience. I'm sure David and/or Justin will fill in the many blanks I've left here. Mostly, it was just wonderful to be back at Asilomar with such good friends. John Bell: << Can anyone enlighten me about why I think there was a character named Otto in one of the Oz books? Am I amalgamating Ato and his Octagon Isle?>> I can't think of an Ozzy Otto other than Fred. He wrote many Ozzy tales and verses. I miss him. --Robin ===================================================================== = From: Ozmama@aol.com Date: Sun, 29 Aug 1999 11:42:49 EDT Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 08-27-99 (Re-send 2) In a message dated 8/28/99 9:52:51 PM Central Daylight Time, OzDigest@mindspring.com writes: Ruth Berman to Warren Baldwin:<< Some of your comments, though (as with the comparison to the Klan) seem more acidic than the kinds of disagreements I recall being registered on the Digest as a rule. (Part of the problem, of course, is in communicating in writing. Comments that were meant as mild "joshing" can come across as harsh "ridicule," and, contrariwise, trying to avoid humorous lightness can come across as a pompous and condescending heaviness, in the absence of tone-of-voice to give the speaker's intention.) Rather than making a general complaint about a habit of ridicule, it might be more useful to complain at the specific times when you feel a disagreement has descended to ridicule. >> Yeah. What she said! Seriously, thanks, Ruth, for saying so well what I was thinking but was too irritated to say politely. We haven't had serious dissent--the kind based on personality, not ideas--here for over two years. I'm not aware of anyone's feeling ignored, but perhaps I wouldn't be.... I am aware of several people, frequently myself included among them, who simply enjoy reading the Digest and don't feel inclined to post to it. If anyone seriously felt "squelched," I suspect s/he would ask Dave to be unsubscribed. Does that happen often, Dave? My guess is that people drop out on a fairly regular basis once they discover that the Digest is not what they thought it would be in the first place, be that an MGM site or something less intense. Essentially, the Digest has found its place among a community of book-based Ozzies who really like dissecting the Oz books. That's a fairly narrow niche, but it's a fascinating one! --Robin ===================================================================== = From: "Jeremy Steadman" Date: Sun, 29 Aug 1999 12:25:41 EST Subject: Re: Ozzy Digest, 08-27-99 (Re-send 2) "Clowns are inherently evil": I don't know that I agree with that. However, the fact that clowns have their entire faces covered with white--an unnatural color for a face--leads people to think them untrustworthy, perhaps. That's just my take on it. Lisa Marie: I think your Oz plot idea sounds very clever--I like it! (Of course, anyone who knows my books knows I like to have whatever the setting is completely demolished and then put back together--it's a sort of fetish of mine, I suppose.) Many Ozzy dreams, Jeremy Steadman, Royal Historian of Oz kivel99@planetall.com http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Dimension/9619/ ICQ# 19222665, AOL Inst Mssgr name kiex or kiex2 "A good example of a parasite? Hmmm, let me think... How about the Eiffel tower?" ===================================================================== = Date: Sun, 29 Aug 99 13:15:44 (PDT) From: Dave Hardenbrook Subject: Ozzy Things _RETURN TO OZ_ ON VIDEO!: I was in the video store (Tower Records) this weekend, and they were selling _Return to Oz_, in both regular and *letterbox* versions!! Just thought you'd all *might* be interested... :) SAFETY IN NUMBER (PREFERABLY 47): David H. wrote: >The "small coterie of >professionals, ex-professionals and would-be professionals who seem to >enjoy without surcease the inbreeding of their own opinions" seems to me to >be more closely related to organizations like ... >US Chess Federation Ask the Polgar sisters about the *International* Chess Federation! (Susan has been stripped of her Woman's World Championship because she dared to have family values, and Judith is of course up against an army of male chauvanists.) > ... or the Jane Austen Society ... On behalf of my mom -- Amen! > ... Or do you have some theory as to how >a dozen or so people on the Ozzy Digest might threaten anyone with their >nit-picking analysis of the fine points of the Oz books? IMHO it depends on who that "dozen or so people" are... If they're publishers, then the possibilty of censorship as "heresy" of one's printed personal view of Oz arises. Warren wrote: >... the science fiction writer who created the cult that's taking >over the Winkies, and tomorrow the world. Who does this refer to? DYING COMPUTER FANS: I think you're right about Ruggedo being at work on our PC's... He must use an Amiga. :) Actually he still seems to be hexing my PC in some ways... When restoring my system I had to recomplie my Ozzy Digest-generating program, and now it will work okay when launched from Visual C++, but when I try to run it from the Desktop it promptly crashes with the "Illegal Operation" dialog, and in the drop-down area says, "Invalid Page Fault in KERNAL32.DLL" GRRR. -- Dave ===================================================================== =